Hey, new to TLS and wanting to get an idea of what my safety-fit-reach schools should be. I hear so much about URM's getting anywhere from a 3-10 LSAT point increase so it's really hard to figure out where I stand...
I immigrated from Nigeria when I was young and I'm still a Nigerian citizen. I graduated from a top large public university with a 3.6 GPA (history major) and got a 152 the first time I took the LSAT. I retook it today but don't feel that great so am considering what my options are with my current score.
I have good (great?) softs pertaining to school (founded an on campus IA journal, several leadership positions, 2 of which I was the first black female elected in the school's history, 2 major research projects and 1 publication) and outside of school (complicated immigration ordeal that lead me to have to work ~30 hours a week my last 2 years of school to support myself). I have 1 great and 2 good recs and I feel confident in my ability to write a great personal statement. I plan on having all my apps in by mid November.
I want to work in government or public interest in the Northeast so,
1. Given my numbers and softs, which one of the following T14, if any, would I have the best shot at? What if I ED?
NYU
UVA
Duke
Georgetown
Cornell
2. Which one of the following T15-50 would I have the best shot at? What if I ED?
George Washington
Boston University
Boston College
Fordham
William and Mary
Gorge Mason
Maryland
American
Cardozo
3. What, if anything, can I do at this point to boost my chances of T50 success? Given my URM status, background and interests, are there any schools that I should consider looking at that I didn't list?
3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances? Forum
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downwithflames43
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20121109
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Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
Welcome to TLS!
First, may I suggest you browse the URM and Law School Admissions Forum to further familiarize yourself with the process? It would be of great help to you.
Second, your softs are average at best. Softs really do not play a determinative role in LS admissions unless they're "harder" than the average soft i.e. Rhodes Scholar, military background etc. Also, your LSAT is not T14 material. A 152 is low even for a URM, and considering your thoughts on your retake, I will assume that this score will not vary significantly.
Third, I am usually loath to recommend early decision for any URM candidate simply because URM cycles are notoriously unpredictable. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a URM get rejected/WLed by a lower-ranked school only to be admitted at a higher-ranked school. Unless you have low numbers or there is absolutely no way you can attend any other school, do not ED anywhere; you will more than likely deny yourself a chance to attend a "better" school and preclude any chances of negotiating merit aid using other acceptance offers. Do you happen to have personal circumstances that make you inclined to ED to a particular school?
Fourth, my best friend had the same stats you have! She now attends St. Johns on a full scholly without stips, but she was WL/rejected at Cornell, rejected at BU, BC and other similarly ranked schools. Please peruse Lawschoolnumbers.com (avoid Law School Predictor - it's pretty inaccurate for URMs) and see the type of schools you should consider.
I hope you found this helpful. Wishing you the best
First, may I suggest you browse the URM and Law School Admissions Forum to further familiarize yourself with the process? It would be of great help to you.
Second, your softs are average at best. Softs really do not play a determinative role in LS admissions unless they're "harder" than the average soft i.e. Rhodes Scholar, military background etc. Also, your LSAT is not T14 material. A 152 is low even for a URM, and considering your thoughts on your retake, I will assume that this score will not vary significantly.
Third, I am usually loath to recommend early decision for any URM candidate simply because URM cycles are notoriously unpredictable. I can't tell you how many times I've seen a URM get rejected/WLed by a lower-ranked school only to be admitted at a higher-ranked school. Unless you have low numbers or there is absolutely no way you can attend any other school, do not ED anywhere; you will more than likely deny yourself a chance to attend a "better" school and preclude any chances of negotiating merit aid using other acceptance offers. Do you happen to have personal circumstances that make you inclined to ED to a particular school?
Fourth, my best friend had the same stats you have! She now attends St. Johns on a full scholly without stips, but she was WL/rejected at Cornell, rejected at BU, BC and other similarly ranked schools. Please peruse Lawschoolnumbers.com (avoid Law School Predictor - it's pretty inaccurate for URMs) and see the type of schools you should consider.
I hope you found this helpful. Wishing you the best
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PDaddy
- Posts: 2063
- Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 4:40 am
Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
DO NOT ED! I also recommend that you try to raise that score by at least 5 points. The wait will be worth it.
Right now, you probably have a shot at your bottom-5, especially Cardozo, American and Maryland with little or no money, but you can put yourself in a much better position by waiting and improving that score. Your GPA is solid, don't waste it.
Outside of the 145-159 bracket (where 50% of all test-takers score), there's no bracket in which an improved score of even 3 points can make such a profound difference in one's opportunities and financial aid. Even a 155 would make your doors so much wider...to the point that T14 schools like UVA, Northwestern, Cornell, and Duke would at least consider you. But you wouldn't get any money.
Ask yourself this question: "Would I wait a year and raise my score if I knew someone would pay me $100,000?" I know the answer. That will make a world of difference for you. 3.62/157 can get you into the top-30 with $$$, and maybe even the same money at top-20 to lower T14 with great essays, LOR's and soft factors. If you can get 160, you could be a candidate for almost any T14, several of them giving you at least $$.
I've seen URM's with 3.4-3.7/160-164 get into HYS. Once you have a decent LSAT score, the rest of the battle is presentation. If you study until June and improve your score to 165+, you are looking at HYS! If you can get to 170, they'll give you a Bugatti! Good luck!
Right now, you probably have a shot at your bottom-5, especially Cardozo, American and Maryland with little or no money, but you can put yourself in a much better position by waiting and improving that score. Your GPA is solid, don't waste it.
Outside of the 145-159 bracket (where 50% of all test-takers score), there's no bracket in which an improved score of even 3 points can make such a profound difference in one's opportunities and financial aid. Even a 155 would make your doors so much wider...to the point that T14 schools like UVA, Northwestern, Cornell, and Duke would at least consider you. But you wouldn't get any money.
Ask yourself this question: "Would I wait a year and raise my score if I knew someone would pay me $100,000?" I know the answer. That will make a world of difference for you. 3.62/157 can get you into the top-30 with $$$, and maybe even the same money at top-20 to lower T14 with great essays, LOR's and soft factors. If you can get 160, you could be a candidate for almost any T14, several of them giving you at least $$.
I've seen URM's with 3.4-3.7/160-164 get into HYS. Once you have a decent LSAT score, the rest of the battle is presentation. If you study until June and improve your score to 165+, you are looking at HYS! If you can get to 170, they'll give you a Bugatti! Good luck!
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afitouri
- Posts: 90
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Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
With a 152, its a very, very long shot.
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Puffin
- Posts: 129
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2012 4:17 pm
Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
retake for mid-ish 160s, nab excellent scholarship at CCN or try for HYS.
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mattviphky
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Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
http://lawschoolnumbers.com/ncblue102/jd
URMs are hard to predict. This guy got 110k to Boston U, but was rejected from Boston College. He got great scholarships from many fine schools, though. His LSAT was a 162, so you will need to study to improve your score, as well as your chances to attend a great school.
URMs are hard to predict. This guy got 110k to Boston U, but was rejected from Boston College. He got great scholarships from many fine schools, though. His LSAT was a 162, so you will need to study to improve your score, as well as your chances to attend a great school.
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mattviphky
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Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
btw, this person did even better with a 160. I think AA females do better than AA males...at least from what i've seen on these sites.http://lawschoolnumbers.com/ajudk8/jd
Get a 160 LSAT-->Cornell with a 105k scholarship sounds like an awesome deal!
Get a 160 LSAT-->Cornell with a 105k scholarship sounds like an awesome deal!
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downwithflames43
- Posts: 8
- Joined: Sun Oct 07, 2012 2:55 am
Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
I'm still a bit confused. There seem to be a lot of LSN profiles of URM's with stats similar to mine that are getting into schools that I'd love to get in
3.62/153 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/CG878/jd (in at Boalt, UVA, Cornell, BC, American)
3.6/155 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/northwestgirl/jd (in at Cornell)
3.18/154 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/LSD22/jd (in at W&L, American, Cardozo)
3.7/146 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/MiaBoi/jd (in at GW, George Mason)
3.3/154 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/caifankid/jd (in at BC)
then this guy got into UVA and Georgetown ED with a 155/3.7 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/AmericanKbart/jd
People with stats similar to mine have gotten into schools I'm looking at but I know my LSAT is low. How can I predict my cycle? How can I set myself apart?
My top schools are Georgetown and GW and I'd do anything to go, even pay sticker. Which one would I have a better chance doing ED with? Or, would it be wise to try to ED at a school where my GPA is at median or 75th percentile - say BC or American?
3.62/153 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/CG878/jd (in at Boalt, UVA, Cornell, BC, American)
3.6/155 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/northwestgirl/jd (in at Cornell)
3.18/154 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/LSD22/jd (in at W&L, American, Cardozo)
3.7/146 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/MiaBoi/jd (in at GW, George Mason)
3.3/154 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/caifankid/jd (in at BC)
then this guy got into UVA and Georgetown ED with a 155/3.7 http://lawschoolnumbers.com/AmericanKbart/jd
People with stats similar to mine have gotten into schools I'm looking at but I know my LSAT is low. How can I predict my cycle? How can I set myself apart?
My top schools are Georgetown and GW and I'd do anything to go, even pay sticker. Which one would I have a better chance doing ED with? Or, would it be wise to try to ED at a school where my GPA is at median or 75th percentile - say BC or American?
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Doorkeeper
- Posts: 4869
- Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 11:25 pm
Re: 3.6/152 black female URM T14 hope? T50 chances?
It is entirely unpredictable.
Look at your chances with your scores now:
http://myLSN.info/8kqkrh
If you bump your score up to a 160, you put every school in the T14 in play from Columbia down.
Look at your chances with your scores now:
http://myLSN.info/8kqkrh
If you bump your score up to a 160, you put every school in the T14 in play from Columbia down.
