Best and worst judges to clerk for Forum

[Anonymous User]

To throw in my 0.02, as someone who's clerked twice I think Isgur's take is completely over the top and Lat's is closer to correct. Expecting clerks not to travel on the weekends (unless it's the weekend of a trial, etc.) is absurd, and most dockets do not require 80-100 hour weeks. Working biglaw hours as a clerk is not an honor, and many judges who place their alumni extremely well require nothing close to that.

My judge informally had everyone come in one day on each end of their clerkship unpaid: the new clerk comes in on Friday, the departing clerk comes back on Monday. I was more than happy to do so both times (and very happy to do so in a polo, khakis, and boat shoes on my "volunteer Monday!"). The judicial salary budget is inflexible, and having a couple days to work on docket transition is invaluable.

I think Isgur and the managing partner Lat spoke to for his Cannon article do have a point: younger lawyers, especially those that have broken in post-COVID, seem to have an expectation of flexibility that didn't exist
in the profession prior to 2020. I'm not going to take a side on the WFH debate, but it's very easy to see how a generational clash between GenZ clerks and judges who practiced for 30 years in the Before Times can happen. And chambers will just about always be less responsive to broader changes in workplace culture than law firms are.

[Anonymous User]

Just gotta say the Advisory Opinions on the Lat reporting is wild. Scorching hot takes from Sarah Isgur like that clerks shouldn’t travel out of town on weekends, the Kozinski clerkship was a good deal, and lawyers should expect 80-100 hour weeks in both clerkships and private practice. I dunno, maybe this does show generational change because I worked for a well-known judge who’s also well-known for long hours, and had a good experience, and I still thought it was batshit. And one of these clerks who she was slamming as soft had a newborn and an explicit no-more-than-40-hours deal. I guess I was lucky my judge was apparently actually a lot more reasonable in expectations than some others out there?

Sarah Isgur is a moronic nepo baby (her dad was a judge) so her opinion is irrelevant.

[Anonymous User]

Sarah Isgur is a moronic nepo baby (her dad was a judge) so her opinion is irrelevant.

Her dad is a random bankruptcy judge no one has ever heard of, what are you on lol

[Anonymous User]

Yeah this is a strange take.

A better take is that it’s not clear she’s practiced a day of law in her life, so you can safely ignore her for that reason.

(And no, acting as counsel to political campaigns is not actually practicing law.)

[Anonymous User]

Can we get back on topic and leave the fighting over what this rando (who is not a judge and did not appear to share any useful information about dealing with bad judges) thinks for another thread.

On the topic of that article re: CA2 mentioned in a previous post, are there any bad bosses on CA2? I think there were some negative comments about Merriam, and I’m wondering if anyone else is similar?

[Anonymous User]

The Second Circuit is generally a pretty good place to clerk across the board. The Lohier experience sounds like no fun, but I would still put up with him for a year. Raggi is old-school and a micromanager. I don’t know much about Merriam but I’m skeptical of any judge on CA2 whose OSCAR emphasizes that their clerks should expect to work very hard. The Second Circuit frankly doesn’t have much work, unless you work for a judge who’s a bad manager, and the worst Second Circuit clerkships probably have a better lifestyle than normal SDNY or CA9 clerkships.

[Anonymous User]

Sarah Isgur is a moronic nepo baby (her dad was a judge) so her opinion is irrelevant.

I am not surprised to learn that Sarah Isgur is in favor of workplace policies that result in separating parents from their children.

[Anonymous User]

Sullivan and Raggi clerks very hard. Raggi requires clerks to come in by 8 am and Sullivan clerks don't leave til midnight.

[Anonymous User]

Sullivan and Raggi clerks very hard. Raggi requires clerks to come in by 8 am and Sullivan clerks don't leave til midnight.

Sullivan clerks work hard, but they don’t work *that* hard, and my understanding is that a good amount of the hours are socializing rather than work. RJS is super-social. Still not for everyone.

[Anonymous User]

Sullivan and Raggi clerks very hard. Raggi requires clerks to come in by 8 am and Sullivan clerks don't leave til midnight.

Sullivan clerks work hard, but they don’t work *that* hard, and my understanding is that a good amount of the hours are socializing rather than work. RJS is super-social. Still not for everyone.

Regardless of whether they’re actually working, they are frequently (if not always?) in chambers until around 11 pm or later. It’s pretty well-known around the courthouse, and RJS clerks are open about it. Raggi, on the other hand, keeps strict hours, but I don’t think I’ve heard that it’s that difficult or long. Probably can go home around 7, at latest.

In terms of working hard, Judge Perez’s clerks are also expected to work an insane amount of hours.

[Anonymous User]

Sullivan and Raggi clerks very hard. Raggi requires clerks to come in by 8 am and Sullivan clerks don't leave til midnight.

Sullivan clerks work hard, but they don’t work *that* hard, and my understanding is that a good amount of the hours are socializing rather than work. RJS is super-social. Still not for everyone.

Regardless of whether they’re actually working, they are frequently (if not always?) in chambers until around 11 pm or later. It’s pretty well-known around the courthouse, and RJS clerks are open about it. Raggi, on the other hand, keeps strict hours, but I don’t think I’ve heard that it’s that difficult or long. Probably can go home around 7, at latest.

In terms of working hard, Judge Perez’s clerks are also expected to work an insane amount of hours.

Have heard similarly about Pérez.

[Anonymous User]

My guess is that the judge the order was concerning was Richard Berman.

[Anonymous User]

My guess is that the judge the order was concerning was Richard Berman.

It's Sarah Merriam.

[Anonymous User]

Confirming that it’s Merriam.

[Anonymous User]

What's the skinny on Pan (CADC)? I've seen some negative stuff in this thread but not many specifics.

[riptide123]

My guess is that the judge the order was concerning was Richard Berman.

what order?

[Anonymous User]

My guess is that the judge the order was concerning was Richard Berman.

It's Sarah Merriam.

Any clerk that complained about the following below is a bonafide loser, I'm sorry:

"The complaint alleges that the Judge committed ethical violations by accepting a gift from an outgoing law clerk of a framed newspaper cutting from the 1970s featuring one of the Judge’s favorite bands, as well as
requesting and accepting a jar of grape jam from a member of chambers staff who was vacationing in New Hampshire."

[Anonymous User]

My guess is that the judge the order was concerning was Richard Berman.

It's Sarah Merriam.

Any clerk that complained about the following below is a bonafide loser, I'm sorry:

"The complaint alleges that the Judge committed ethical violations by accepting a gift from an outgoing law clerk of a framed newspaper cutting from the 1970s featuring one of the Judge’s favorite bands, as well as
requesting and accepting a jar of grape jam from a member of chambers staff who was vacationing in New Hampshire."

Yeah, that sounds like the clerk had reached "bitch eating crackers" stage with the judge.

[Anonymous User]

My guess is that the judge the order was concerning was Richard Berman.

It's Sarah Merriam.

Any clerk that complained about the following below is a bonafide loser, I'm sorry:

"The complaint alleges that the Judge committed ethical violations by accepting a gift from an outgoing law clerk of a framed newspaper cutting from the 1970s featuring one of the Judge’s favorite bands, as well as
requesting and accepting a jar of grape jam from a member of chambers staff who was vacationing in New Hampshire."

Yeah, that sounds like the clerk had reached "bitch eating crackers" stage with the judge.

Relatedly are we actually not allowed to give our judges little bs presents? Chambers would always exchange little gifts like this.

[Anonymous User]

Any information on Judge Loken? Hiring preferences re school, grades, etc?

[Anonymous User]

Does Beetlestone hire straight out? Or only w WE?

[Anonymous User]

I know she hires law students, including spring 2Ls (e.g. she doesn't abide by the Plan) but not sure whether it's for immediately after graduation or for a year or two down the road.

[Anonymous User]

What's the deal with Pan (CADC)? Have heard generally not great stuff but no specifics.

[Anonymous User]

What's the deal with Pan (CADC)? Have heard generally not great stuff but no specifics.

Man the stuff I've heard about her... Truthfully I don't know if there is any current sitting judge I've been warned about more. As far as specifics-just instances of her being a mean person. I didn't clerk for her or on the D.C. Circuit so I can't verify though.

[Anonymous User]

What's the deal with Pan (CADC)? Have heard generally not great stuff but no specifics.

Man the stuff I've heard about her... Truthfully I don't know if there is any current sitting judge I've been warned about more. As far as specifics-just instances of her being a mean person. I didn't clerk for her or on the D.C. Circuit so I can't verify though.

I recently clerked on D.C. Cir (but not for Pan). She has a tendency to be abusive, mean, and borderline cruel. Not just to clerks but also to colleagues and counsel. The hours also seem longer than necessary given the D.C. Circuit’s caseload. Avoid.