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3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 4:43 am
by BillyJean
Long story short, my BS is from a top 10 undergraduate school. 7 years of WE and graduate degree from a T14 school. I'm considering a JD because of my particular research interests and professional goals. Think intersection of law and my particular discipline. It's not unheard of, but definitely uncommon to have the dual qualifications - yet the relationship is very relevant.

I'm mainly interested in part-time programs, although that only leaves Gtown in the top 14.

How far can the best softs take you?
Americorps, TFA, peace corps, military....check
Work for a prestigious organization....check
Named scholarship....check
Beyond those basics, my profile is one in a million, quite literally. For the sake of anonymity, I want to leave it at that because any details would be too specific. You'll have to entertain me and use your imagination, but rest assured, I'm not simply a fighter pilot, spy, neurosurgeon, Trump administration dropout, or ethical hacker. If you were on the admissions committee, one of your thoughts might be that you'll never see another applicant like this again.

I'm not Waldo, Carmen Sandiego, or Nessie. Just curious about what truly unique and diverse softs can do for me despite my numbers.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 5:58 am
by stego
This seems like flame. Is it flame?

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:01 am
by rpupkin
retake

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:02 am
by cavalier1138
But Tiffany Trump already got in...

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:55 am
by tr5890
Sounds like your resume is top notch, but unless you cured cancer or stopped a genocide I think great things on your resume have a diminishing effect. So many great things after a while just stop mattering. My question as a T14 admissions officer would be why you didn't take your undergrad or the LSAT more seriously. Unless you graduated from a school like West Point where a 3.05 isn't a complete joke, or have some killer reason why your GPA is so low, that hurts you. Your LSAT score doesn't save you. You didn't get a Rhodes, Marshall, or Truman with that GPA. Hope you have some insane thing up your sleeve and not just several really good things pilled on.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:15 am
by devilblue
And Georgetown is not in the top 14. That's one of many things you've said that just aren't true; the Georgetown one is just the only one I can easily validate

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:27 am
by hopefuljumbo23
devilblue wrote:And Georgetown is not in the top 14. That's one of many things you've said that just aren't true; the Georgetown one is just the only one I can easily validate


Ehhhh. T14 is a historical thing. Imho, Georgetown will always be seen as a T14.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:35 am
by sparkytrainer
hopefuljumbo23 wrote:
devilblue wrote:And Georgetown is not in the top 14. That's one of many things you've said that just aren't true; the Georgetown one is just the only one I can easily validate


Ehhhh. T14 is a historical thing. Imho, Georgetown will always be seen as a T14.


Naw f that. They are more like WUSTL and UCLA than they are NU or Cornell. It is officially the t13 for lyfe.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:49 am
by BillyJean
tr5890 wrote:Sounds like your resume is top notch, but unless you cured cancer or stopped a genocide I think great things on your resume have a diminishing effect. So many great things after a while just stop mattering. My question as a T14 admissions officer would be why you didn't take your undergrad or the LSAT more seriously. Unless you graduated from a school like West Point where a 3.05 isn't a complete joke, or have some killer reason why your GPA is so low, that hurts you. Your LSAT score doesn't save you. You didn't get a Rhodes, Marshall, or Truman with that GPA. Hope you have some insane thing up your sleeve and not just several really good things pilled on.



My bachelors is from school with a track record grade deflation. As far as 'great things that stop mattering', are you referring to the guy in my LSAT who had two masters, an MBA, and a PhD, who wanted to go to law school 'just cuz'? Thats not me.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:04 am
by silenttimer
BillyJean wrote:
tr5890 wrote:Sounds like your resume is top notch, but unless you cured cancer or stopped a genocide I think great things on your resume have a diminishing effect. So many great things after a while just stop mattering. My question as a T14 admissions officer would be why you didn't take your undergrad or the LSAT more seriously. Unless you graduated from a school like West Point where a 3.05 isn't a complete joke, or have some killer reason why your GPA is so low, that hurts you. Your LSAT score doesn't save you. You didn't get a Rhodes, Marshall, or Truman with that GPA. Hope you have some insane thing up your sleeve and not just several really good things pilled on.



My bachelors is from school with a track record grade deflation. As far as 'great things that stop mattering', are you referring to the guy in my LSAT who had two masters, an MBA, and a PhD, who wanted to go to law school 'just cuz'? Thats not me.


While your resume is very good, law school admission traditionally has been focused primarily on quantitative measures (GPA + LSAT). Unless you have something truly stellar such as the Rhodes, Marshall, Truman, etc., your very good resume will only help you if you are already a fringe candidate to T14. Unfortunately, your numbers are not there yet. If you can raise you LSAT by 3-5 points, then I think you will have a good shot at lower T14 (likely no money).

That said, you also may sneak into Georgetown with your current stat.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:07 am
by LurkerTurnedMember
I know a Muslim refugee who escaped genocide and literally grew up dirt poor after starting all over with nothing here in the United States. She even had better numbers (LSAT and GPA) than you but she still didn't outperform her numbers. The only boost you'll get is if you're a URM. Nothing else really matters. So unless one of your softs is a URM status, which doesn't seem to be, you're out of luck. I know It's not right (and probably unconstitutional for some schools) but that's just where admissions is right now.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:36 am
by BillyJean
silenttimer wrote:
BillyJean wrote:
tr5890 wrote:Sounds like your resume is top notch, but unless you cured cancer or stopped a genocide I think great things on your resume have a diminishing effect. So many great things after a while just stop mattering. My question as a T14 admissions officer would be why you didn't take your undergrad or the LSAT more seriously. Unless you graduated from a school like West Point where a 3.05 isn't a complete joke, or have some killer reason why your GPA is so low, that hurts you. Your LSAT score doesn't save you. You didn't get a Rhodes, Marshall, or Truman with that GPA. Hope you have some insane thing up your sleeve and not just several really good things pilled on.



My bachelors is from school with a track record grade deflation. As far as 'great things that stop mattering', are you referring to the guy in my LSAT who had two masters, an MBA, and a PhD, who wanted to go to law school 'just cuz'? Thats not me.


While your resume is very good, law school admission traditionally has been focused primarily on quantitative measures (GPA + LSAT). Unless you have something truly stellar such as the Rhodes, Marshall, Truman, etc., your very good resume will only help you if you are already a fringe candidate to T14. Unfortunately, your numbers are not there yet. If you can raise you LSAT by 3-5 points, then I think you will have a good shot at lower T14 (likely no money).

That said, you also may sneak into Georgetown with your current stat.


Thanks.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:54 am
by BillyJean
LurkerTurnedMember wrote:I know a Muslim refugee who escaped genocide and literally grew up dirt poor after starting all over with nothing here in the United States. She even had better numbers (LSAT and GPA) than you but she still didn't outperform her numbers. The only boost you'll get is if you're a URM. Nothing else really matters. So unless one of your softs is a URM status, which doesn't seem to be, you're out of luck. I know It's not right (and probably unconstitutional for some schools) but that's just where admissions is right now.



I know that girl, too. My friend has the same compelling story, but it's all sob absent of any standout achievement (obviously making her way to law school was incredible, but you know what I mean). Not trying to be a dick, but that's the truth for her. I'm not trying to antagonize you, just hoping my application is seen in a much different light. If not, that's the way it is, I'll be fine.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:57 am
by BillyJean
Is there any possibility of money as I descend the part time rankings?

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 12:56 pm
by Justtrying2help
OP post your results in this thread after your cycle so it can be an anecdotal test case for the importance of softs in law school admissions (or the lack of importance). I think your softs are definitely above average for the t-14 but not elite. This likely means you will perform roughly where your numbers suggest your should. I predict you will be shut out of the t-13 unless you apply early decision somewhere with a perfect app (which I do not think is a good idea for you). I predict the best school you will get accepted into will be one just outside the top 20 schools. Hopefully for your sake I am wrong. Good luck OP!

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 4:16 pm
by tr5890
BillyJean wrote:
tr5890 wrote:Sounds like your resume is top notch, but unless you cured cancer or stopped a genocide I think great things on your resume have a diminishing effect. So many great things after a while just stop mattering. My question as a T14 admissions officer would be why you didn't take your undergrad or the LSAT more seriously. Unless you graduated from a school like West Point where a 3.05 isn't a complete joke, or have some killer reason why your GPA is so low, that hurts you. Your LSAT score doesn't save you. You didn't get a Rhodes, Marshall, or Truman with that GPA. Hope you have some insane thing up your sleeve and not just several really good things pilled on.



My bachelors is from school with a track record grade deflation. As far as 'great things that stop mattering', are you referring to the guy in my LSAT who had two masters, an MBA, and a PhD, who wanted to go to law school 'just cuz'? Thats not me.


I didn't say anything about your reason to go to law school, merely that stuffing a resume with a lot of stuff stops helping you at some point. Retake the LSAT if you can. I wouldn't expect to outperform your numbers unless you're a URM or you have something insanely prestigious (Rhodes, Marshall, Truman, Olympic medal, groundbreaking peer-reviewed article, NY times best seller, etc.).

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 4:20 pm
by tr5890
Anecdotally, I worked with a guy who had slightly better numbers than you last cycle, had published a book, 4 super prestigious internships, overcome a major disability, and phenomenal recommendations. Was rejected from every T20 school he applied to.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 4:21 pm
by stego
hopefuljumbo23 wrote:
devilblue wrote:And Georgetown is not in the top 14. That's one of many things you've said that just aren't true; the Georgetown one is just the only one I can easily validate


Ehhhh. T14 is a historical thing. Imho, Georgetown will always be seen as a T14.

Historically, none of the top 14 schools had ever fallen out of the top 14.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 5:23 pm
by LurkerTurnedMember
BillyJean wrote:
LurkerTurnedMember wrote:I know a Muslim refugee who escaped genocide and literally grew up dirt poor after starting all over with nothing here in the United States. She even had better numbers (LSAT and GPA) than you but she still didn't outperform her numbers. The only boost you'll get is if you're a URM. Nothing else really matters. So unless one of your softs is a URM status, which doesn't seem to be, you're out of luck. I know It's not right (and probably unconstitutional for some schools) but that's just where admissions is right now.



I know that girl, too. My friend has the same compelling story, but it's all sob absent of any standout achievement (obviously making her way to law school was incredible, but you know what I mean). Not trying to be a dick, but that's the truth for her. I'm not trying to antagonize you, just hoping my application is seen in a much different light. If not, that's the way it is, I'll be fine.


It seems all sob but in reality it is an achievement. To go from point A to point B in life where such a path is unheard of is a huge accomplishment AND it additionally colors the person's character, work ethic, outlook in life, and all that, so it adds so much more than just being an accomplishment on paper, than something like "Oh look I applied here and they picked me so I'm a Soros Fellow.. Yay!" The latter type is def not as impressive to me and I'll admit it even though I have the latter type of achievements. Think of it this way, LeBron or someone of his height doing a 360 dunk is impressive but a 5 foot 3 guy with a broken leg doing just a regular dunk is even more so.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:39 pm
by cavalier1138
You sound like you come across as likable, charming, and not-at-all full of yourself. So you should be great. Don't bother retaking the LSAT, and follow your dreams!

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:50 pm
by lawlorbust
BillyJean wrote:If you were on the admissions committee, one of your thoughts might be that you'll never see another applicant like this again.


If you were a Olympic gold medallist, you might sniff UT. Good luck!

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:03 pm
by sanzgo
quit dreamin bud. unless you're a URM, no chance in hell. and actually your softs aren't super, at least within the context of LS admissions.

i also know a non-URM refugee who went through extreme hardship to get to where he/she is right now. his/her story is un-fucking-believable. i also know a URM who grew up in wealthy suburban mountainview who's attending HYS with much lower numbers than that refugee. welcome to MURICA, the land of the free, the home of the brave, the country of people who're not judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character LMAO

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:41 pm
by dm1683
BillyJean wrote:
LurkerTurnedMember wrote:I know a Muslim refugee who escaped genocide and literally grew up dirt poor after starting all over with nothing here in the United States. She even had better numbers (LSAT and GPA) than you but she still didn't outperform her numbers. The only boost you'll get is if you're a URM. Nothing else really matters. So unless one of your softs is a URM status, which doesn't seem to be, you're out of luck. I know It's not right (and probably unconstitutional for some schools) but that's just where admissions is right now.



I know that girl, too. My friend has the same compelling story, but it's all sob absent of any standout achievement (obviously making her way to law school was incredible, but you know what I mean). Not trying to be a dick, but that's the truth for her. I'm not trying to antagonize you, just hoping my application is seen in a much different light. If not, that's the way it is, I'll be fine.

I love how being a genocide survivor is not valued as much as being urm. All in favor of affirmative action but this is absurd.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:46 pm
by stego
sanzgo wrote:quit dreamin bud. unless you're a URM, no chance in hell. and actually your softs aren't super, at least within the context of LS admissions.

i also know a non-URM refugee who went through extreme hardship to get to where he/she is right now. his/her story is un-fucking-believable. i also know a URM who grew up in wealthy suburban mountainview who's attending HYS with much lower numbers than that refugee. welcome to MURICA, the land of the free, the home of the brave, the country of people who're not judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character LMAO

Just FYI we have a lounge thread dedicated to discussing the merits of affirmative action but you're not supposed to discuss that anywhere else because it tends to derail conversations, hurt feelings, and lead to the same things being said over and over again.

Re: 3.05 /165 - Super softs - T14?

Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:47 pm
by stego