International Applicants 2016-17 cycle Forum

[pleasesendhelp]

Somehow, it's probably Trumps fault

[madxkings]

Lack of a reportable GPA is what puts anyone with a non-reportable GPA at a some disadvantage because you don't help medians unlike someone with a reportable GPA. In this analysis, citizenship is immaterial. We are talking pure numbers. It becomes material for things like tie breaking between nearly equal non-reportable GPA candidates in terms of numbers. The competition within a given school's applicant pool also plays a big role.

A bit late, but nice to know so I can curb my expectations.

I had been told that having nonreportable GPAs with above median LSATS would be advantageous since we'd be "freebies" to boost their numbers. Maybe we have an advantage over splitters?

Yeah, we don't hurt medians and that could be helpful for a law school struggling maintain them. One would think an AA is a better numerical bet than a low GPA applicant. But the process takes so much else into consideration that it is hard to say who has an advantage.

> 175/AA applicant here, I don't think my AA evaluation is doing me any favors this cycle, out of the T-14s I have heard back from I was waitlisted at Chicago, Penn, Duke, Northwestern, Cornell and rejected at Stanford and Michigan. Actually came into this cycle thinking that AA > low GPA but now I'm not so sure

Some more data: A couple AAs with 170 and 172 respectively have been dinged/Wled at Cornell. I m forgetting their TLS names. I got WL at NU with 171/Superior though not doing the interview may have (speculatively) played a role too. Hard to tell what's going on.

I got dinged at Cornell, 172 AA.

[CA1993]

Lack of a reportable GPA is what puts anyone with a non-reportable GPA at a some disadvantage because you don't help medians unlike someone with a reportable GPA. In this analysis, citizenship is immaterial. We are talking pure numbers. It becomes material for things like tie breaking between nearly equal non-reportable GPA candidates in terms of numbers. The competition within a given school's applicant pool also plays a big role.

A bit late, but nice to know so I can curb my expectations.

I had been told that having nonreportable GPAs with above median LSATS would be advantageous since we'd be "freebies" to boost their numbers. Maybe we have an advantage over splitters?

Yeah, we don't hurt medians and that could be helpful for a law school struggling maintain them. One would think an AA is a better numerical bet than a low GPA applicant. But the process takes so much else into consideration that it is hard to say who has an advantage.

> 175/AA applicant here, I don't think my AA evaluation is doing me any favors this cycle, out of the T-14s I have heard back from I was waitlisted at Chicago, Penn, Duke, Northwestern, Cornell and rejected at Stanford and Michigan. Actually came into this cycle thinking that AA > low GPA but now I'm not so sure

Some more data: A couple AAs with 170 and 172 respectively have been dinged/Wled at Cornell. I m forgetting their TLS names. I got WL at NU with 171/Superior though not doing the interview may have (speculatively) played a role too. Hard to tell what's going on.

I got dinged at Cornell, 172 AA.

I heard Cornell was really pushing for GPA this year so maybe that's why? At this point though AA seems to basically be a roll of the dice

[plimpton]

Late to the party but wanted to check in. I'm a Superior, submitted around the tenth of January and have gotten an interview at Georgetown and Columbia so far. I'm an American that studied in the UK, it's been super helpful to hear about everyone else's experience so thought I'd contribute. Will put in my results once I hear back from more schools, basically just applied to T-14

[XUMickeal]

Lack of a reportable GPA is what puts anyone with a non-reportable GPA at a some disadvantage because you don't help medians unlike someone with a reportable GPA. In this analysis, citizenship is immaterial. We are talking pure numbers. It becomes material for things like tie breaking between nearly equal non-reportable GPA candidates in terms of numbers. The competition within a given school's applicant pool also plays a big role.

A bit late, but nice to know so I can curb my expectations.

I had been told that having nonreportable GPAs with above median LSATS would be advantageous since we'd be "freebies" to boost their numbers. Maybe we have an advantage over splitters?

Yeah, we don't hurt medians and that could be helpful for a law school struggling maintain them. One would think an AA is a better numerical bet than a low GPA applicant. But the process takes so much else into consideration that it is hard to say who has an advantage.

> 175/AA applicant here, I don't think my AA evaluation is doing me any favors this cycle, out of the T-14s I have heard back from I was waitlisted at Chicago, Penn, Duke, Northwestern, Cornell and rejected at Stanford and Michigan. Actually came into this cycle thinking that AA > low GPA but now I'm not so sure

Dude have you considered how the rest of your packet might have impacted your application? I'm at 169/AA with no W/E but got into some pretty decent schools. I'd say PS, optional essays and your resume play an equally important, or even pivotal sometimes, role in your application as opposed to your LSAT scores and CAS evaluation.

[potatocowpower]

Lack of a reportable GPA is what puts anyone with a non-reportable GPA at a some disadvantage because you don't help medians unlike someone with a reportable GPA. In this analysis, citizenship is immaterial. We are talking pure numbers. It becomes material for things like tie breaking between nearly equal non-reportable GPA candidates in terms of numbers. The competition within a given school's applicant pool also plays a big role.

A bit late, but nice to know so I can curb my expectations.

I had been told that having nonreportable GPAs with above median LSATS would be advantageous since we'd be "freebies" to boost their numbers. Maybe we have an advantage over splitters?

Yeah, we don't hurt medians and that could be helpful for a law school struggling maintain them. One would think an AA is a better numerical bet than a low GPA applicant. But the process takes so much else into consideration that it is hard to say who has an advantage.

> 175/AA applicant here, I don't think my AA evaluation is doing me any favors this cycle, out of the T-14s I have heard back from I was waitlisted at Chicago, Penn, Duke, Northwestern, Cornell and rejected at Stanford and Michigan. Actually came into this cycle thinking that AA > low GPA but now I'm not so sure

Dude have you considered how the rest of your packet might have impacted your application? I'm at 169/AA with no W/E but got into some pretty decent schools. I'd say PS, optional essays and your resume play an equally important, or even pivotal sometimes, role in your application as opposed to your LSAT scores and CAS evaluation.

I was invited to interview at schools after some review time so I assume my essay didn't break me, and they seemed satisfied with my resume, I have a couple of years of W/E.

[hellohalo]

Lack of a reportable GPA is what puts anyone with a non-reportable GPA at a some disadvantage because you don't help medians unlike someone with a reportable GPA. In this analysis, citizenship is immaterial. We are talking pure numbers. It becomes material for things like tie breaking between nearly equal non-reportable GPA candidates in terms of numbers. The competition within a given school's applicant pool also plays a big role.

A bit late, but nice to know so I can curb my expectations.

I had been told that having nonreportable GPAs with above median LSATS would be advantageous since we'd be "freebies" to boost their numbers. Maybe we have an advantage over splitters?

Yeah, we don't hurt medians and that could be helpful for a law school struggling maintain them. One would think an AA is a better numerical bet than a low GPA applicant. But the process takes so much else into consideration that it is hard to say who has an advantage.

> 175/AA applicant here, I don't think my AA evaluation is doing me any favors this cycle, out of the T-14s I have heard back from I was waitlisted at Chicago, Penn, Duke, Northwestern, Cornell and rejected at Stanford and Michigan. Actually came into this cycle thinking that AA > low GPA but now I'm not so sure

Dude have you considered how the rest of your packet might have impacted your application? I'm at 169/AA with no W/E but got into some pretty decent schools. I'd say PS, optional essays and your resume play an equally important, or even pivotal sometimes, role in your application as opposed to your LSAT scores and CAS evaluation.

I was invited to interview at schools after some review time so I assume my essay didn't break me, and they seemed satisfied with my resume, I have a couple of years of W/E.

Did you get a JS1? You should really re-exam your application... you are underperforming with your numbers. Sorry.

[potatocowpower]

Lack of a reportable GPA is what puts anyone with a non-reportable GPA at a some disadvantage because you don't help medians unlike someone with a reportable GPA. In this analysis, citizenship is immaterial. We are talking pure numbers. It becomes material for things like tie breaking between nearly equal non-reportable GPA candidates in terms of numbers. The competition within a given school's applicant pool also plays a big role.

A bit late, but nice to know so I can curb my expectations.

I had been told that having nonreportable GPAs with above median LSATS would be advantageous since we'd be "freebies" to boost their numbers. Maybe we have an advantage over splitters?

Yeah, we don't hurt medians and that could be helpful for a law school struggling maintain them. One would think an AA is a better numerical bet than a low GPA applicant. But the process takes so much else into consideration that it is hard to say who has an advantage.

> 175/AA applicant here, I don't think my AA evaluation is doing me any favors this cycle, out of the T-14s I have heard back from I was waitlisted at Chicago, Penn, Duke, Northwestern, Cornell and rejected at Stanford and Michigan. Actually came into this cycle thinking that AA > low GPA but now I'm not so sure

Dude have you considered how the rest of your packet might have impacted your application? I'm at 169/AA with no W/E but got into some pretty decent schools. I'd say PS, optional essays and your resume play an equally important, or even pivotal sometimes, role in your application as opposed to your LSAT scores and CAS evaluation.

I was invited to interview at schools after some review time so I assume my essay didn't break me, and they seemed satisfied with my resume, I have a couple of years of W/E.

Did you get a JS1? You should really re-exam your application... you are underperforming with your numbers. Sorry.

No JS1, been UR there since December
Perhaps the fact that I retook a 173~175 score might be bringing on the YP?

[hellohalo]

No JS1, been UR there since December
Perhaps the fact that I retook a 173~175 score might be bringing on the YP?

There's no YP in HLS. They like internationals. With 175, they will be interested in who you are and want to talk to you.
Don't wanna hurt your feelings. But either there are red flags in your app , or you are just trolling here .

[potatocowpower]

No JS1, been UR there since December
Perhaps the fact that I retook a 173~175 score might be bringing on the YP?

There's no YP in HLS. They like internationals. With 175, they will be interested in who you are and want to talk to you.
Don't wanna hurt your feelings. But either there are red flags in your app , or you are just trolling here .

Oh I meant YP for the lower ranked schools in the T14, since I did retake a score that was at least 75th percentile for all but Y and H . Columbia, Cornell and Georgetown did like my application enough to interview me. I wish this was a joke and all these outcomes were imaginary but it's not

[yhchoi1687]

Hey guys just checked in.
I submitted my apps from mid Dec to early Jan (with stats 173 & Superior).
Only heard back from Columbia yesterday that I was put into hold category

One thing just curious - I attended low-tier Ivy League school for three sems and transferred to my current uni in Hong Kong because of financial issues (I am Korean though).
My gpa would be unreportable one anyway, but do you think academic records in the US (my gpa at that school is 4.0) could give me some benefits?

[freekick]

Hey guys just checked in.
I submitted my apps from mid Dec to early Jan (with stats 173 & Superior).
Only heard back from Columbia yesterday that I was put into hold category

One thing just curious - I attended low-tier Ivy League school for three sems and transferred to my current uni in Hong Kong because of financial issues (I am Korean though).
My gpa would be unreportable one anyway, but do you think academic records in the US (my gpa at that school is 4.0) could give me some benefits?

Hold at Columbia with your stats is a bit surprising.

Don't you have interview invites from lower t14? If not, hang in. Internationals have to generally wait a bit longer for decisions so you are far from done. Those 3 semesters of 4.0 would most certainly help. All the best.

[yhchoi1687]

Hey guys just checked in.
I submitted my apps from mid Dec to early Jan (with stats 173 & Superior).
Only heard back from Columbia yesterday that I was put into hold category

One thing just curious - I attended low-tier Ivy League school for three sems and transferred to my current uni in Hong Kong because of financial issues (I am Korean though).
My gpa would be unreportable one anyway, but do you think academic records in the US (my gpa at that school is 4.0) could give me some benefits?

Hold at Columbia with your stats is a bit surprising.

Don't you have interview invites from lower t14? If not, hang in. Internationals have to generally wait a bit longer for decisions so you are far from done. Those 3 semesters of 4.0 would most certainly help. All the best.

Thanks. Your comments make me feel better.
I was quite disappointed since I thought my Columbia interview went well.
But I saw in the forum that even student who got in YLS was also held...why Columbia so tough in this cycle:'(
Anyway, I would send a LOCI by the end of this month.
All this waiting time is so frustrating haha

[CA1993]

Hey guys just checked in.
I submitted my apps from mid Dec to early Jan (with stats 173 & Superior).
Only heard back from Columbia yesterday that I was put into hold category

One thing just curious - I attended low-tier Ivy League school for three sems and transferred to my current uni in Hong Kong because of financial issues (I am Korean though).
My gpa would be unreportable one anyway, but do you think academic records in the US (my gpa at that school is 4.0) could give me some benefits?

Hold at Columbia with your stats is a bit surprising.

Don't you have interview invites from lower t14? If not, hang in. Internationals have to generally wait a bit longer for decisions so you are far from done. Those 3 semesters of 4.0 would most certainly help. All the best.

Fully paranoid about my Columbia interview and my AA designation now.... Seems like a lot of high LSAT scores are being turned away

[pleasesendhelp]

Dinged at Berkeley today

I think GPA definitely matters folks (AA eval with below 3.5 GPA)

[yhchoi1687]

Dinged at Berkeley today

I think GPA definitely matters folks (AA eval with below 3.5 GPA)

+1

Me too (though with 173 & superior)
I am now really worried about my apps.

[BEng,MBA,FRM,JD(?)]

Dinged at Berkeley today

I think GPA definitely matters folks (AA eval with below 3.5 GPA)

+1

Me too (though with 173 & superior)
I am now really worried about my apps.

Hey, dinged too. 167 and Superior. So, perhaps no combination of numbers and LSAC evaluation matters. Berk may simply want an alien-free land this fall

[pleasesendhelp]

Dinged at Berkeley today

I think GPA definitely matters folks (AA eval with below 3.5 GPA)

+1

Me too (though with 173 & superior)
I am now really worried about my apps.

Hey, dinged too. 167 and Superior. So, perhaps no combination of numbers and LSAC evaluation matters. Berk may simply want an alien-free land this fall

Maybe their new scholarship program makes it cost-inefficient to admit too many foreign degree holders (even though I'm a US citizen...)

[stepney]

just want to give people another data point/bit of hope - i got waitlisted at cornell, vanderbilt, and UPenn, but got in at Columbia and Berkeley. I got pretty much a full ride offered from Emory, but almost no money from BC. (I'm 173/AA btw).

Looking at some of the other results from international applicants here it really does seem that either the expected level of predictability in the process (gleaned by spending a lot of time looking at rankings and reading TLS) might be misleading, or maybe international students are assessed via slightly different/less predictable criteria than other applicants. I think its probably a bit of both, internationalness is an extra catagory to worry about which isn't in vogue right now. We're all dirty foreigners and we'll all be spending our entire law school careers under a Trump presidency (possibly). Its not unimaginable that occasionally someone in an admissions office is looking at 2 broadly equal applicants, one American and one foreign, and thinking that its not worth the possible bother in the future to have the complications of an international student body. Maybe, i don't know. The man did just threaten to pull federal funding from UC Berkeley.

But either way, just because you weren't accepted into one, doesn't mean that a nominally higher ranked institution won't accept you as they did me, so keep your chin up.

[yhchoi1687]

just want to give people another data point/bit of hope - i got waitlisted at cornell, vanderbilt, and UPenn, but got in at Columbia and Berkeley. I got pretty much a full ride offered from Emory, but almost no money from BC. (I'm 173/AA btw).

Looking at some of the other results from international applicants here it really does seem that either the expected level of predictability in the process (gleaned by spending a lot of time looking at rankings and reading TLS) might be misleading, or maybe international students are assessed via slightly different/less predictable criteria than other applicants. I think its probably a bit of both, internationalness is an extra catagory to worry about which isn't in vogue right now. We're all dirty foreigners and we'll all be spending our entire law school careers under a Trump presidency (possibly). Its not unimaginable that occasionally someone in an admissions office is looking at 2 broadly equal applicants, one American and one foreign, and thinking that its not worth the possible bother in the future to have the complications of an international student body. Maybe, i don't know. The man did just threaten to pull federal funding from UC Berkeley.

But either way, just because you weren't accepted into one, doesn't mean that a nominally higher ranked institution won't accept you as they did me, so keep your chin up.

Thanks, dude.
I just need one acceptance from any school so that I could be ensured my app package didn't have a terrible mistake All others are just in dead silence...
Can I ask when did you submit your apps?

[stepney]

just want to give people another data point/bit of hope - i got waitlisted at cornell, vanderbilt, and UPenn, but got in at Columbia and Berkeley. I got pretty much a full ride offered from Emory, but almost no money from BC. (I'm 173/AA btw).

Looking at some of the other results from international applicants here it really does seem that either the expected level of predictability in the process (gleaned by spending a lot of time looking at rankings and reading TLS) might be misleading, or maybe international students are assessed via slightly different/less predictable criteria than other applicants. I think its probably a bit of both, internationalness is an extra catagory to worry about which isn't in vogue right now. We're all dirty foreigners and we'll all be spending our entire law school careers under a Trump presidency (possibly). Its not unimaginable that occasionally someone in an admissions office is looking at 2 broadly equal applicants, one American and one foreign, and thinking that its not worth the possible bother in the future to have the complications of an international student body. Maybe, i don't know. The man did just threaten to pull federal funding from UC Berkeley.

But either way, just because you weren't accepted into one, doesn't mean that a nominally higher ranked institution won't accept you as they did me, so keep your chin up.

Thanks, dude.
I just need one acceptance from any school so that I could be ensured my app package didn't have a terrible mistake All others are just in dead silence...
Can I ask when did you submit your apps?

late november for the most part. late january apps for NW and Yale, but haven't heard back from either of those. you'll get your acceptance though. int students take longer, its nothing personal to you.

[cftvgybhu]

LSAT >75%, /superior，applied 1/17, sent Why UVA+DS, just got waitlisted at UVA.
still heard nothing from the other T14, so kind of in a complicated mood, a bit frustrated but not totally unexpected.
Though I heard that UVA has not been very friendly to international students, but i still want to ask,

1) is it because i am not good enough, or the school's YP? (Has anyone here admitted in UVA?)
2) Does anybody know the chance of ad after being waitlisted?
3) is it worth sending LOCI?

Thanks, would really appreciate if someone could talk about this.

[freekick]

LSAT >75%, /superior，applied 1/17, sent Why UVA+DS, just got waitlisted at UVA.
still heard nothing from the other T14, so kind of in a complicated mood, a bit frustrated but not totally unexpected.
Though I heard that UVA has not been very friendly to international students, but i still want to ask,

1) is it because i am not good enough, or the school's YP? (Has anyone here admitted in UVA?)
2) Does anybody know the chance of ad after being waitlisted?
3) is it worth sending LOCI?

Thanks, would really appreciate if someone could talk about this.

1. There is a lot more (don't know what all) to it than just our LSAT scores and GPA evaluations, as a lot of us have been discovering in this thread this cycle. While nobody could say anything reasonable without looking at the entire app, in case of UVA one could assume their traditional lack of love for Internationals to be a (not the only or major) cause.

2. Chances of getting off the WL are highly unpredictable and vary cycle to cycle.

3. Do send a LOCI. Wouldn't hurt for sure. Can only help.

Sorry about your outcome at UVA. It has been one rough t14 ride for most internationals this year.

[Baby Gaga]

LSAT >75%, /superior，applied 1/17, sent Why UVA+DS, just got waitlisted at UVA.
still heard nothing from the other T14, so kind of in a complicated mood, a bit frustrated but not totally unexpected.
Though I heard that UVA has not been very friendly to international students, but i still want to ask,

1) is it because i am not good enough, or the school's YP? (Has anyone here admitted in UVA?)
2) Does anybody know the chance of ad after being waitlisted?
3) is it worth sending LOCI?

Thanks, would really appreciate if someone could talk about this.

UVA in particular is rough on internationals, I don't think they had any at all last year. I wouldn't feel too bad.

[cftvgybhu]

LSAT >75%, /superior，applied 1/17, sent Why UVA+DS, just got waitlisted at UVA.
still heard nothing from the other T14, so kind of in a complicated mood, a bit frustrated but not totally unexpected.
Though I heard that UVA has not been very friendly to international students, but i still want to ask,

1) is it because i am not good enough, or the school's YP? (Has anyone here admitted in UVA?)
2) Does anybody know the chance of ad after being waitlisted?
3) is it worth sending LOCI?

Thanks, would really appreciate if someone could talk about this.

UVA in particular is rough on internationals, I don't think they had any at all last year. I wouldn't feel too bad.

Thanks, your username is kind of funny, LOL