Overheard at the LSAT Forum

[northwood]

if you really want to do something, you will find ways to put yourself in the best position for success. That means doing basic research about things that are necessary for entrance, and preparing for them. If you really want to become a lawyer, and go to law school, basic research will tell you that you have to take an entance exam. Most people will want to do the best on this exam, and will prepare for it as such. If it takes a month, 3 months, 6 months or a year, those that really want to achieve their goal will put in as much effort as possible. If you give it your best effort, and still dont reach the magic number needed for admission, then unfortunately you wont be able to achieve your goal. It happens. Those that try their best, and end up short are not being laughed at in this thread. Its only the ignorant people who show up without preparing for the test that are the source of the jokes on this thread. Those that tried their very best, and walked out of the test knowing they gave it their all are not the source of the jokes here, regardless if they scored a 121 or a 181

[Adjudicator]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

[KevinP]

I won't make fun of people who just aren't bright enough for this. I feel bad for those people.

But I have no problem making fun of the people who just fail to make any effort to prepare.

This.

If some kid is there who knows he's not cut out for law school, but whose parents are pressuring him to take the LSAT, and he does the best he can and even studied a bit, and he gets a 145 on the test, that's not funny at all. I feel awful for him (and angry at his parents).

Some girl who really wants to be a lawyer and has spent six months preparing for the LSAT with courses and PTs and still can't get her score above a 150 isn't mock-worthy. She probably shouldn't go to law school, but it's sad because she's likely not going to achieve her dream.

Someone who doesn't even read the page of instructions that comes with your ticket that says NO MECHANICAL PENCILS, NO CELL PHONES, etc. is a moron, even if they have an IQ of 175.

Plenty of people who scored below 150 on the LSAT are not only lawyers, but are thriving in the profession! Some went to top law schools and some did not. So, the notion that someone who scores lower on the lSAT isn't qualified to be a lawyer is just nonsense. There are Harvard students who aren't qualified and CAl Western grads who are. Tough to conceptualize, and even tougher to accept, but it's true.

Your definition of plenty, thriving, and qualified are a bit skewed.

[Gemini]

It would be elitist if only certain people had access to good information, or the best prep materials. But everyone has equal access to those things.

have to wholeheartedly disagree with you there...

yeah, that's just blatantly wrong.


does anyone have any funny proctor stories? mine was crackin jokes like he was gettin' paid for laughs. it took the edge of but it was also like, wtf...

Mine wasn't too funny but after section five, she collected all our answer sheets and handbooks. Then she turned around and just said "BREATHE" and it just cracked us up.

[Gemini]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

Lol I really do have to agree with you, being one of them! I really regret that waste of money!

[northwood]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

i disagree. i freely admit to taking a prep class ( it was 800) and did so to force myself to create and stick to a structured study schedule during the summer months. Plus, the course had a lot of prep material that came with it, so I had all of the question types broken down with plenty of drill practice before starting my prep

I learn better in a group environment, and paying money made me do all of the work, go to classes when id rather be outside. But I gave myself plenty of time from the end of hte class to october 9th to prep on my own

[ThreeYears]

It would be elitist if only certain people had access to good information, or the best prep materials. But everyone has equal access to those things.

have to wholeheartedly disagree with you there...

yeah, that's just blatantly wrong.


does anyone have any funny proctor stories? mine was crackin jokes like he was gettin' paid for laughs. it took the edge of but it was also like, wtf...

Mine wasn't too funny but after section five, she collected all our answer sheets and handbooks. Then she turned around and just said "BREATHE" and it just cracked us up.

UVa?

[PDaddy]

It would be elitist if only certain people had access to good information, or the best prep materials. But everyone has equal access to those things.

have to wholeheartedly disagree with you there...

I once disagreed with the above post, and I am URM. But I have to say that if someone wants the information they can get it. Presumably they went to college, and they have a pre-law advisor. They have peers who are applying, and their peers can serve as resources (book sharing, study groups, etc). They have computers or access to them, and can get on the web, where there is a host of information. If they need books and are too poor to pay full price, they can buy them used. The LSAC gives waivers (over multiple years in some cases) for poorer students.

Some schools offer their students financial aid/scjholarships that pay for grad prep, even if the student doesn't want to apply to his own UG. Most test prep books are sold in the stores, and the same people who claim they have no money are out at clubs on weekends drinking, or at the mall on weekends shopping. Instead of buying new $200 Timberlands and Jordans and spending $50 on alcohol in one night, save that money for law prep.

And LSAT prep courses aren't always a good idea for some students. if you train alone, you can go at your own pace. Many higher scoring URM's have found that this worked better for them after they took a course, where the teachers paid little attention to helping them overcome their weaknesses or were biased towards the other students, for whatever reasons.

A lot of URM's and poor whites do not have the "immediate access" to the same resources (i.e., tutoring, relatives who are lawyers, etc), but they can overcome those disadvantages if they truly want to. At some point, it has to be about desire and discipline.

[Adjudicator]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

i disagree. i freely admit to taking a prep class ( it was 800) and did so to force myself to create and stick to a structured study schedule during the summer months. Plus, the course had a lot of prep material that came with it, so I had all of the question types broken down with plenty of drill practice before starting my prep

I learn better in a group environment, and paying money made me do all of the work, go to classes when id rather be outside. But I gave myself plenty of time from the end of hte class to october 9th to prep on my own

Well, I'm glad that it worked for you, northwood, and I sincerely hope you get a score that you are happy with.

[Gemini]

UVa?

No, somewhere in NY.

[ThreeYears]

UVa?

No, somewhere in NY.

haha, our proctor did the exact same thing.

[northwood]

. At some point, it has to be about desire and discipline.[/quote]


absolutely agree with this.

[Adjudicator]

It would be elitist if only certain people had access to good information, or the best prep materials. But everyone has equal access to those things.

have to wholeheartedly disagree with you there...

I once disagreed with the above post, and I am URM. But I have to say that, if someone wants the information, they can get it. Presumably, they went to college, and they have a pre-law advisor. They have peers who are applying. They have computers or access to them, and can get on the web, where there is a host of information. If they need books and are too poor to pay full price, they can buy them used. The LSAC gives waivers (over multiple years in some cases) for poorer students.

Some schools offer their students financial aid/scjholarships that pay for grad prep, even if the student doesn't want to apply to his own UG. Most test prep books are sold in the stores, and the same people who claim they have no money are out at clubs on weekends drinking, or at the mall on weekends shopping. Instead of buying new $200 Timberlands and Jordans and spending $50 on alcohol in one night, save that money for law prep.

And LSAT prep courses aren't always a good idea for some students. if you train alone, you can go at your own pace. Many higher scoring URM's have found that this worked better for them after they took a course, where the teachers paid little attention to helping them overcome their weaknesses or were biased towards the other students, for whatever reasons.

A lot of URM's and poor whites do not have the "immediate access" to the same resources (i.e., tutoring, relatives who are lawyers, etc), but they can overcome those disadvantages if they truly want to. At some point, it has to be about desire and discipline.

+1. Really, great post.

[lsatter]

In an effort to get back on topic...

"It's a curved test, so it's better for me if you do badly. Bad luck, guys."

I wasn't sure if I should be impressed or scared.

[NJcollegestudent]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

I do not disagree that prep classes are not helpful, however, for someone who can afford a private tutor, they have accesses to a different type of resources that is not available to all.

[cinefile 17]

Aww, this was a funny thread.

I know right.

[Adjudicator]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

I do not disagree that prep classes are not helpful, however, for someone who can afford a private tutor, they have accesses to a different type of resources that is not available to all.

That's true, but I don't really think a private tutor is necessary to do well. All that is really necessary is the LG Bible and a stack of PrepTests.

[ShuckingNotJiving]

I once disagreed with the above post, and I am URM. But I have to say that if someone wants the information they can get it. Presumably they went to college, and they have a pre-law advisor. They have peers who are applying, and their peers can serve as resources (book sharing, study groups, etc). They have computers or access to them, and can get on the web, where there is a host of information. If they need books and are too poor to pay full price, they can buy them used. The LSAC gives waivers (over multiple years in some cases) for poorer students.

Some schools offer their students financial aid/scjholarships that pay for grad prep, even if the student doesn't want to apply to his own UG. Most test prep books are sold in the stores, and the same people who claim they have no money are out at clubs on weekends drinking, or at the mall on weekends shopping. Instead of buying new $200 Timberlands and Jordans and spending $50 on alcohol in one night, save that money for law prep.

And LSAT prep courses aren't always a good idea for some students. if you train alone, you can go at your own pace. Many higher scoring URM's have found that this worked better for them after they took a course, where the teachers paid little attention to helping them overcome their weaknesses or were biased towards the other students, for whatever reasons.

A lot of URM's and poor whites do not have the "immediate access" to the same resources (i.e., tutoring, relatives who are lawyers, etc), but they can overcome those disadvantages if they truly want to. At some point, it has to be about desire and discipline.

Bill Cosby? Is that you?

[tazmolover]

A lot of people in general don't have money for prep courses or tutors...just limiting that to URM's is pretty ignorant.

[NJcollegestudent]

People who pay for those thousand-dollar prep classes are suckers.

I do not disagree that prep classes are not helpful, however, for someone who can afford a private tutor, they have accesses to a different type of resources that is not available to all.

That's true, but I don't really think a private tutor is necessary to do well. All that is really necessary is the LG Bible and a stack of PrepTests.

I agree, i self-studied and got the books. I improved from an initial diagnostic of a 145 to what i had on my very last pt 156, and hopefully the last few weeks of prep pushed me just above that.

[kaftka juice]

Just to clear the air and *hopefully* get this thread back on track:

I created this thread to be like http://www.overheardinnewyork.com/ or [url]www.http://textsfromlastnight.com/[/url]. I really wasn't aiming for bashing people who score under a certain percentile. We're all humans, and as humans, we all say and do silly things. Sometimes, other humans hear and see these silly things and find them amusing. Perhaps someone signed up for something without realizing what they got into. Maybe a person did not read directions carefully and were consequently placed in a humorously awkward situation.

Please now, stop derailing this thread from its intended purpose of finding human behavior occasionally silly!!

[Ginj]

I once disagreed with the above post, and I am URM. But I have to say that if someone wants the information they can get it. Presumably they went to college, and they have a pre-law advisor. They have peers who are applying, and their peers can serve as resources (book sharing, study groups, etc). They have computers or access to them, and can get on the web, where there is a host of information. If they need books and are too poor to pay full price, they can buy them used. The LSAC gives waivers (over multiple years in some cases) for poorer students.

Some schools offer their students financial aid/scjholarships that pay for grad prep, even if the student doesn't want to apply to his own UG. Most test prep books are sold in the stores, and the same people who claim they have no money are out at clubs on weekends drinking, or at the mall on weekends shopping. Instead of buying new $200 Timberlands and Jordans and spending $50 on alcohol in one night, save that money for law prep.

And LSAT prep courses aren't always a good idea for some students. if you train alone, you can go at your own pace. Many higher scoring URM's have found that this worked better for them after they took a course, where the teachers paid little attention to helping them overcome their weaknesses or were biased towards the other students, for whatever reasons.

A lot of URM's and poor whites do not have the "immediate access" to the same resources (i.e., tutoring, relatives who are lawyers, etc), but they can overcome those disadvantages if they truly want to. At some point, it has to be about desire and discipline.

Bill Cosby? Is that you?

Totes lolz.

I agree with Mr. Cosby. I qualified for a need-based fee waiver and got someone else's used Powerscore bibles from last year. All and all, it'll probably cost me about $180 in LSAC reports and $180 for PT's to test in February and apply to 19 schools next year.

Knowledge is power.

[akili]

For example:
I went to the LSAT in a ninja costume (Minus the mask, of course. That's not allowed.). No joke, I was test-ninja: something I would occasionally do in undergrad (may have just outed myself).

I laughed. That's totally awesome. Seriously. Was a sword allowed in the testing room? What about throwing stars?

[Helmholtz]

This thread reeks of undeserved elitism and an overvalued sense of self worth.

Welcome to law school / the legal field!

[longdaysjourney]

Andy has totally ruined Cornell for me.... no joke.

I'm glad i'm not the only one.