Top Law Schools

hey guys, i just took the LSAT for the 1st time in October. Prior to that i had taken practice tests and did the kaplan program..my highest score was a 148..i want to go to law school somewhere in new york, i need advice on what schools in new york will accept. my lsat score was lower

LSAT: 142
GPA: 3.2


if you guys can help me that would be great. thank you.

if it is possible, I would try and retake the LSAT and get a higher score. however, if you can't- The LSAC website has a UGPA and LSAT search where you can type in your gpa and lsat. It tells you what percentage you have getting into each law school. Hope this assists you.

As a graduate of a top-ten school, I do have one piece of advice in choosing a school. If you know FOR CERTAIN the market in which you want to practice after law school, choose the best school IN THAT MARKET that you get into, even if you get into "better" schools in other markets.

To illustrate, I am from Los Angeles, and I knew 100 percent that I was going to return to Los Angeles to practice no matter where I went to school. Not having received this stellar advice I am offering here, I went to law school in Chicago. Now, I loved my law school, but certain things hold true that I didn't really consider:

1. Interviewing for a job in Los Angeles is much more difficult if you live in Chicago. All my law school friends who were interviewing in Chicago could schedule callbacks at any time (even on a morning of a day they had afternoon classes). I had to fly to the West Coast every Wednesday night, interview all day Thursday and Friday, and fly back. Exhausting, irritating, bad for school AND interviewing, and kinda pointless. If I had gone to school in LA, my interviewing would have been far easier.

2. Most school, even those with national reputations, open doors more easily in their home market than elsewhere. I work at a firm where the VAST majority of attorneys went to UCLA or USC . . . or Loyola (Los Angeles). The same is true in Chicago firms---they have a huge preponderance of Chicago and Northwestern grads, as well as John Marshall and Loyola (Chicago) grads. A degree from a Chicago school (even a top-ranked one) just doesn't open the doors in LA that a degree from a "lesser" LA school would. And the same holds true for someone trying to get a job in Chicago with a UCLA or USC degree. You're still going to get a good job, of course. But it will be much more trying, and you won't get the same range of offers.

3. If you go to school where you intend to work after graduation, you will have a much easier time summering at a local firm. I had to move from Chicago to LA twice---once for my summer, and once after graduation. If I had gone to school in LA, summering would have been easy.

4. If you summer after 1L and/or 2L, and you go to school in the same market, you may have the opportunity to work at your firm during 3L. A summer colleague of mine who went to USC worked 10-12 hours per week (at a pretty nice wage) during 3L simply because she was already in LA, where our firm is. She earned money, and, more importantly, got lots of experience that I had to wait until after the bar to get. I could have worked during 3L as well, but I was in Chicago.

5. Some of the best friends you are ever going to have will be from law school. About half my law school friends stayed in Chicago, and the rest went to DC, NY, etc. Not one came to LA. I wouldn't trade these friends for the world, but if I had gone to school (even a "lesser") school in LA, I would have made some really good friends who would have probably been in the same city after graduation.

Just my thoughts, but something to consider as you are choosing schools. Don't get too caught up in the rankings. Use some common sense.

Are you seriously suggesting that Loyola (LA) will open up more doors than U of Chicago? I am not saying that I know more than you, but looking at the profiles of V100 firms in Southern California, I am not finding many Loyola graduates among their associates. While on the other hand U of C seems to be pretty well represented considering its small class size. I plan on working on the west coast, maybe LA, but I would be way too scared to go as far down as Loyola.

Whatisthis wrote:Are you seriously suggesting that Loyola (LA) will open up more doors than U of Chicago? I am not saying that I know more than you, but looking at the profiles of V100 firms in Southern California, I am not finding many Loyola graduates among their associates. While on the other hand U of C seems to be pretty well represented considering its small class size. I plan on working on the west coast, maybe LA, but I would be way too scared to go as far down as Loyola.

i don't think he is suggesting turn down UofC for Loyola ... but if you know for certain you wish to work in LA give more thought to attending local schools like Berkeley, UCLA, or USC (if he got in UofC, I am certain he would get in 2 out of these 3)

I am just suggesting that people take it into consideration. Obviously, UChicago opens doors everywhere. But in my LA office, for example, there are only a handful of people from UChicago, whereas UCLA, USC, and even Loyola grads are everywhere. (And yes, it's a top 20 firm.) So if you come here to interview, you are pretty much guaranteed to meet lots of people who will root you on because of the school. I went to Northwestern, and there were more Loyola people (3) in my starting class than NU people (1). And MANY more in the firm. It's just something to think about, along with the other reasons I gave.

Of course, if you are not sure of your market, go to the best school you can manage!

is UMiami worth going to at full price?

i've been accepted to UMiami, Stetson, FIU, and likely won't get into FSU or UF (156 LSAT, 3.39 LSDAS GPA). i already have about $40,000 debt from undergrad, and can't really afford to pay out of state tuition plus room and board, so i sort of have to stay in florida (i would also like to stay here).

thanks

When looking at a potential law school, you might want to consider the cost-benefit relationship of each. Sometimes investing more can mean getting more out of your law school experience as far as education is concerned, but this is not always the case as MOST law schools are pretty expensive anyway. If location is an issue, then I would say pick a school in a location where you feel most comfortable but not TOO comfortable. If you choose to stay home sometimes friends and family may serve as distractions that you DON'T need while in law school. Consider a place where you can see yourself getting the most out of your legal education all while maintaining a healthy social life.

Overall, you have some good numbers relative to how some people perform academically and on the LSAT so now all you have to do is decide what means more to you, and once you've figured that out then you're good to go.

I hope this helped in some kind of way. Keep us posted and good luck!

-BWA

Ken wrote:
The last possibility is that you have Ws (Withdrawals) on your record which LSAC counts as punitive, meaning that these classes count as an F in your LSAC GPA. It is possible to remedy this problem if you convince your university to change these to non-punitive Ws, but I think the process for doing this at most universities is somewhat cumbersome.

There needs to be some serious clarification on W's versus WF's. LSAC explicitly states that WF's will be counted (as F's), and doesn't say anything about W's.

Do some schools not have WF's and only have W's? Therefore, a W could count as an F at that school?

In my experience, W's are NOT punitive at most schools because you receive a WF if it is punitive. Hence the attached F.

My school does not count my W's as punitive and I will be damned if LSAC does. If they do, I'm sure my school would be on my side and inform the LSAC that those W's are not punitive.

If they're not punitive at your school, LSAC will not count them against you.

how significant is the ranking/reputation of your undergraduate institution in determining your acceptance to a law school?

for instance, if someone has in index score of 5.7 from a 3rd/4th tier institution and another applicant has a 5.5 from a tier 1 or 2, who has the better chance of admission?

hurricane87 wrote:how significant is the ranking/reputation of your undergraduate institution in determining your acceptance to a law school?

As with so many things, it really depends on several issues. One such factor would be the school that you are applying to, University of Chicago, for instance, is known to favor elite schools in their admissions process.

On the other hand, some may argue that some law schools only care about your LSAC GPA, since that is what they have to report for the rankings.

Looking at LawSchoolNumbers.com, I feel that I lost out by going to an undergraduate institution that is not even ranked by US News. At schools that I am still waiting on, or was waitlisted at, applicants with comparable numbers who had gone to Ivys were accepted.

Splitt3r wrote:

ndf9894 wrote:"The most important thing is to receive the highest possible GPA. Pick a major where you can get a fantastic GPA. If you double major or graduate early, make sure to keep that GPA up, ADCOMMS don't care what you do."

How accurate is this statement? You may know better than I do, but I've talked to a former professor who teaches at a law school and he seemed very confident that a 4.0 in marketing is very different from a 4.0 in philosophy (this excludes the hard sciences because theyre clearly more difficult)

Basically, he's wrong

I like to spam.

This is probably a VERY stupid question, and anyone who would like to answer it has every right to laugh at me.

How do you find out what your LSDAS GPA is? All I see on all of my transcripts, etc. is 3.8, so I am figuring that my regular GPA and LSDAS GPA are the same. I have never transferred from a school or withdrawn from a class, but I have studied abroad so I'm kind of wondering if those grades are playing a part in my LSDAS GPA...

wildcatsss wrote:This is probably a VERY stupid question, and anyone who would like to answer it has every right to laugh at me.

How do you find out what your LSDAS GPA is? All I see on all of my transcripts, etc. is 3.8, so I am figuring that my regular GPA and LSDAS GPA are the same. I have never transferred from a school or withdrawn from a class, but I have studied abroad so I'm kind of wondering if those grades are playing a part in my LSDAS GPA...

If you go onto LSAC.org, and look under your documents for your reports that are sent to schools, it will have your LSDAS GPA.

My Docs-> Transcripts -> Academic Summary Report

sf87 wrote:

wildcatsss wrote:This is probably a VERY stupid question, and anyone who would like to answer it has every right to laugh at me.

How do you find out what your LSDAS GPA is? All I see on all of my transcripts, etc. is 3.8, so I am figuring that my regular GPA and LSDAS GPA are the same. I have never transferred from a school or withdrawn from a class, but I have studied abroad so I'm kind of wondering if those grades are playing a part in my LSDAS GPA...

If you go onto LSAC.org, and look under your documents for your reports that are sent to schools, it will have your LSDAS GPA.

My Docs-> Transcripts -> Academic Summary Report

Ah ok, that's where I had looked. I guess I have the same LSDAS GPA as regular GPA...whew! Thank you for answering my question, I appreciate it.

no problem!

When you're adding a recommender in LSAC, under contact information do you need to put their actual home street address, or do you list the contact information for their office at school? All I have for her address is the building name and floor (and the city and zipcode), but there's no actual street.

sleepisforsissies wrote:When you're adding a recommender in LSAC, under contact information do you need to put their actual home street address, or do you list the contact information for their office at school? All I have for her address is the building name and floor (and the city and zipcode).

School address is fine.

^Thanks.

I have questions regarding personal statements. I'm applying this year so I figure I should start on writing them now, but none of the applications to the schools I would like to apply to are even up yet. Can I even begin drafting them? Or are all the prompts for personal statements essentially the same year to year? And can you use the same essay for most of the schools you apply to? Because looking at the personal statement sample thread people are only posting one essay and listing what schools they were rejected from/accepted at.

sleepisforsissies wrote:^Thanks.

I have questions regarding personal statements. I'm applying this year so I figure I should start on writing them now, but none of the applications to the schools I would like to apply to are even up yet. Can I even begin drafting them? Or are all the prompts for personal statements essentially the same year to year? And can you use the same essay for most of the schools you apply to? Because looking at the personal statement sample thread people are only posting one essay and listing what schools they were rejected from/accepted at.

The vast majority of schools have one essay prompt that is the same (or very similar) as everyone else. I only wrote one for the approximately 10 schools I applied to. You can definitely start working on a PS now (as long as you have already taken the LSAT, if not, go back to studying).

Thanks again.

Another question about LORs: I have entered all of the info about my prof and I'm about to give the form to her. After she writes the letter/sends it to LSAC and they receive it, will it be then that I assign which schools get the letter? I'm just confused because on the LSAC site they list the steps to be followed, but assigning the letters to schools is bulleted right after naming the recommender and right before giving the LOR form to the recommender.

When applying, am I required or asked to list the other schools I am applying to? If I am not required, does choosing to not list the other schools disadvantage me in any way?

tumbleweed664 wrote:When applying, am I required or asked to list the other schools I am applying to? If I am not required, does choosing to not list the other schools disadvantage me in any way?

Most schools do not ask this at all. However, of the applications I have seen that ask this, none of them made it seem like an optional question.

Ken wrote:My GPA was only 2.95, but I majored in (hard major) at (Reputable University), so what will adcomms see my GPA as in reality?

In all probability, they will see it as a 2.95.

Difficult majors (especially engineering and the physical sciences - history is not a difficult major) are taken into account, but not hugely. The reason for this, or at least one reason for this, is that when USNews and the like calculate rankings, they just look at the average GPA of the incoming class and do not take into account things like majors or whether that GPA was earned at Chico State or UC Berkeley.

Add a link to this thread: OP lists, by LSAT score, dozens of LSN profiles of applicants with science/math/engineering UG degrees: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... =2&t=74289