2019 February California Bar Forum

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lexingtonhr

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by lexingtonhr » Sat May 18, 2019 11:28 am

maureenwct wrote:Haven't been able to look yet. I was with friends last night and didn't want to do so. Now, I am just avoiding looking by everything else. UGH.
Just check. It's going to be on your mind all weekend. I wanted to rip the bandage off as soon as possible.

lexingtonhr

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by lexingtonhr » Sat May 18, 2019 11:34 am

rcharter1978 wrote:Congrats to those who passed! Its fun to re-live the feeling through you guys.

For those who didn't pass, you can do it. Take the weekend, be mad, angry, frustrated and approach it with a clear mind on Monday. And then it's time to talk about scores, strategies and weak spots.
Did you have a tutor when you took the exam again?

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rcharter1978

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by rcharter1978 » Sat May 18, 2019 11:49 am

lexingtonhr wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:Congrats to those who passed! Its fun to re-live the feeling through you guys.

For those who didn't pass, you can do it. Take the weekend, be mad, angry, frustrated and approach it with a clear mind on Monday. And then it's time to talk about scores, strategies and weak spots.
Did you have a tutor when you took the exam again?
Yes, I got a tutor and passed the second time.

But I absolutely needed one. The written portion was my kryptonite.

Ciedam08

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by Ciedam08 » Sat May 18, 2019 1:10 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:
lexingtonhr wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:Congrats to those who passed! Its fun to re-live the feeling through you guys.

For those who didn't pass, you can do it. Take the weekend, be mad, angry, frustrated and approach it with a clear mind on Monday. And then it's time to talk about scores, strategies and weak spots.
Did you have a tutor when you took the exam again?
Yes, I got a tutor and passed the second time.

But I absolutely needed one. The written portion was my kryptonite.
Do you mind sharing what tutor you used. Or have any suggestions on a reputable tutor? I definitely am needing a tutor this time! These application fees are ridiculous, so I need to make sure this next time is my last!

Ciedam08

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by Ciedam08 » Sat May 18, 2019 1:19 pm

lexingtonhr wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
lexingtonhr wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
lexingtonhr wrote:
Ciedam08 wrote:
Heyall wrote:Bummer, didnt pass.
Same. So upset :cry:
Same, also upset, and trying to figure out my next move.
Start preparing for July on Monday. The clock is ticking and you have like 2.5 months. Take the weekend to grieve but get right back on it.
I'm working right now.. It sucks and I don't have a study plan.
I generally think that's a good idea. But I think you need and deserve a weekend just to chill and be pissy.

If you're gonna self study there are a million resources out there with calendars and study guides.

You may also want to see your scores, unless, like me you knew your weaknesses as soon as you walked out of the bar exam.

But overall, I think you have the right attitude - just keep on the grind, get it done, pass this test and put it in your rearview.

And while it sucks, just know that it's not an indictment of your intelligence. So many smart people don't pass. I remember seeing a guy who was like one of the top 5 students in our class when I retook.

I was shocked and assumed it was some sort of trick, because I never in a million years thought this guy would be retaking. But u knew that if that guy could fail....anyone could fail.qq
Thank you. I really appreciate the words of encouragement, because it is something that I really need to hear right now. I know these feelings will pass. I'm letting it all out as much as I can. I am motivated to do this again and figure out my weak areas. There was a girl that was top 2 of my class and she failed the first time. I found out she passed yesterday.

Anyways, I know its not an indicator of intelligence. A friend told me yesterday that he knows a successful attorney who has failed 4 times in CA but pass NV first time. It's strange, but I suppose once you get it down, you know how to beat the game. Once again, I have to dedicate 2 months of my life to this.. Putting my life on pause once again. It sucks.
It's comforting reading these comments. I wished we all could have passed, but its nice to know that my feelings are normal and I am not alone! I totally feel the way you feel! I had told myself that if I failed I was going to wait until next year, but now I feel like I should just try again and try and beat this damn test. I think I will need to get a tutor this time! I am just nervous of not knowing how to create a different study plan this time! I used Barbri the last two times, so now Im thinking thats not the way to go for me. AHHH!!! Good luck! I think we should create a thread for retakes for the July 2019 bar, so we can all support one another and try and beat this together!

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lexingtonhr

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by lexingtonhr » Sat May 18, 2019 1:41 pm

Ciedam08 wrote:
lexingtonhr wrote:

Thank you. I really appreciate the words of encouragement, because it is something that I really need to hear right now. I know these feelings will pass. I'm letting it all out as much as I can. I am motivated to do this again and figure out my weak areas. There was a girl that was top 2 of my class and she failed the first time. I found out she passed yesterday.

Anyways, I know its not an indicator of intelligence. A friend told me yesterday that he knows a successful attorney who has failed 4 times in CA but pass NV first time. It's strange, but I suppose once you get it down, you know how to beat the game. Once again, I have to dedicate 2 months of my life to this.. Putting my life on pause once again. It sucks.
It's comforting reading these comments. I wished we all could have passed, but its nice to know that my feelings are normal and I am not alone! I totally feel the way you feel! I had told myself that if I failed I was going to wait until next year, but now I feel like I should just try again and try and beat this damn test. I think I will need to get a tutor this time! I am just nervous of not knowing how to create a different study plan this time! I used Barbri the last two times, so now Im thinking thats not the way to go for me. AHHH!!! Good luck! I think we should create a thread for retakes for the July 2019 bar, so we can all support one another and try and beat this together!
[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]


I agree, that would be a good idea. I am thinking of getting a tutor as well, but I'm going to do more research to find the best one. I was using a private bar company with this tutor this past Feb. and it was not the best.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by JDJM6215 » Sat May 18, 2019 3:31 pm

I did not pass, very bummed. Signed up for July, this will be #7. Here's hoping it is lucky number 7, although luck really has nothing to do with the graders. Will post my scores when I get them. Already have a room next to the Oakland convention center. I am going to ride my motorcycle down from Lake Shastina. All the people I met in February were so smart and all felt it was the hardest administration to date from the repeaters I talked to. Last July was easier, so it will be interesting to see my test score this time around and what areas I need to focus on. Professional responsibility is an area I need to focus on, evidence and con law, so here I go again but I know I'm not alone. Study hard those who didn't pass. BUT CONGRATULATIONS to all of you here that passed, you are amazing and I wish you lots of success.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by repeattaker » Sat May 18, 2019 3:37 pm

This was my 3rd attempt & I finally passed this damn test! To those who didn’t get the news they wanted, I know how you feel. After failing for the 2nd time I contemplated moving to a different state to help my bruised ego. Trust me, with persistence & determination you WILL pass this test. Use this experience along with all the anger you’re feeling to motivate you even more.

In my second attempt I failed by 40 points. I passed the mbe but my essays were lacking & I failed the PT. I kept brushing off the importance of the PT. This time around I did more PT practice. Although this PT was difficult I think I had a good idea of what was being asked. I truly feel this was the reason I passed.

Don’t focus so much on memorization. Focus on understanding what you’re studying. Time is not your friend on the bar exam. You can write out a million rule statements & try to memorize it but if you’re like me your mind will blank during the test & you will forget what you memorized. When you understand what you’re studying you’ll be able to make your own rule statements on the spot.

This time I self-studied. I used baressays, adaptibar, Mary basicks essay writing book, & strategies & tactics book. I previously made flash cards for every subject which I used as well.

If you need any help feel free to message me.

Pema

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by Pema » Sat May 18, 2019 5:56 pm

Does anyone have articulable recommendations for scoring 70's uniformly on the essays regardless of the subject? Thanks.

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nowyouscantleave

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by nowyouscantleave » Sat May 18, 2019 6:25 pm

Pema wrote:Does anyone have articulable recommendations for scoring 70's uniformly on the essays regardless of the subject? Thanks.
This sounds tedious but what you can do is go through every single sample answer provided by the course you took, pull out all the rules from every essay and organize it in a document in the order that corresponds to the course outline.
Then, go through every single sample answer on a given subject and outline it. You’ll start to see a pattern for questions and how issues are asked together, basically only the facts will vary. Once you know all the possible structure types and have all the possible rules to plug in, it should be easier to tackle any essay without surprises.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by CALTEX » Sat May 18, 2019 7:05 pm

I passed the Attorney Exam ( Day 1 - no MBE) on my second try! I did not pass in July 2018 and I was super bummed. But I dusted myself off, picked up my pride, and registered for the Feb 2019 exam. I passed the Texas Bar Exam MANY years ago and it was a 3 day exam. That said, nothing has challenged me more than the CBX. It is tough, but you can do it. If I can at my age, you you all can.

I studied Themis, both times ( free the 2nd go round!) and I credit my dedicated essay writer for his constructive criticism for my essay improvement. My advice, for what it's worth, is write at least 2 essays every day and make note of and incorporate in your outline all of the rule statements from the model answers. On the PT, write one of those beasts every week. 3 days before the exam, I wrote 3 of them in one day. It was horrible, but I did it.

Also, during round 2 I endured a root canal and later food poisoning from some hot wings I ate on Super Bowl Sunday.
But I forced myself to press on.

I want to give away my study materials to whoever's needs them. If you live in the Burbank/Glendale area, message me and I am glad to meet you at a Starbucks and give them to you and I am glad to share my study strategies if you think it will help.

Hang in there and NEVER GIVE UP!!!!

CALTEX

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by CALTEX » Sat May 18, 2019 7:08 pm

Will the mailed results let you know your essay scores if you passed? I did not pass last time and they let me know then. Thank you.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by ReasonablePersonSSC » Sat May 18, 2019 7:23 pm

CALTEX wrote:Will the mailed results let you know your essay scores if you passed? I did not pass last time and they let me know then. Thank you.
You will never know your score.

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CALTEX

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by CALTEX » Sat May 18, 2019 7:29 pm

ReasonablePersonSSC wrote:
CALTEX wrote:Will the mailed results let you know your essay scores if you passed? I did not pass last time and they let me know then. Thank you.
You will never know your score.
Thanks for letting me know. But that is weird business.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by ReasonablePersonSSC » Sat May 18, 2019 7:32 pm

CALTEX wrote:I passed the Attorney Exam ( Day 1 - no MBE) on my second try! I did not pass in July 2018 and I was super bummed. But I dusted myself off, picked up my pride, and registered for the Feb 2019 exam. I passed the Texas Bar Exam MANY years ago and it was a 3 day exam. That said, nothing has challenged me more than the CBX. It is tough, but you can do it. If I can at my age, you you all can.

I studied Themis, both times ( free the 2nd go round!) and I credit my dedicated essay writer for his constructive criticism for my essay improvement. My advice, for what it's worth, is write at least 2 essays every day and make note of and incorporate in your outline all of the rule statements from the model answers. On the PT, write one of those beasts every week. 3 days before the exam, I wrote 3 of them in one day. It was horrible, but I did it.

Also, during round 2 I endured a root canal and later food poisoning from some hot wings I ate on Super Bowl Sunday.
But I forced myself to press on.

I want to give away my study materials to whoever's needs them. If you live in the Burbank/Glendale area, message me and I am glad to meet you at a Starbucks and give them to you and I am glad to share my study strategies if you think it will help.

Hang in there and NEVER GIVE UP!!!!
Great advice!
Because the Performance Test is worth two essays, I would also suggest downloading the free MPTs from the NCBE site and at least reading the Point Sheets for each one. They give insight on what the graders look for, and after reading several you start to see the tricks to spot the issues, rules, and facts quickly. The Point Sheets point to the points for higher scores.

lexingtonhr

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by lexingtonhr » Sat May 18, 2019 7:43 pm

Noobmaster69 wrote:Passed on second try. First time i self studied for 50 days using adaptibar and barbri mini conviser. Second time I studied for 80 days using Themis and critical pass flash cards. Worked ft during both times. As someone with zero knowledge in us law prior to this whole process, I say really put in the time to study.
Were you close to the passing score the first time? I am debating on whether or not I want to take Themis. I took Barbri the first time, and took this private bar company the second time. I'm working right now, but did not work the first two times.

CALTEX

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by CALTEX » Sat May 18, 2019 7:54 pm

lexingtonhr wrote:
Noobmaster69 wrote:Passed on second try. First time i self studied for 50 days using adaptibar and barbri mini conviser. Second time I studied for 80 days using Themis and critical pass flash cards. Worked ft during both times. As someone with zero knowledge in us law prior to this whole process, I say really put in the time to study.
Were you close to the passing score the first time? I am debating on whether or not I want to take Themis. I took Barbri the first time, and took this private bar company the second time. I'm working right now, but did not work the first two times.
My scores the first time were BAD. I tanked on a Con Law essay (Commerce Clause market participant). Also. I thought I did great on the PT but I tanked on that too. I finished early, thought I was awesome. Not so!! Ugh!

So, on the second try, I typed each answer for the max time. My fingers did not leave the keyboard until the bell rang. More is better (not like real lawyering). So, no I was not close the first try.

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Noobmaster69

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by Noobmaster69 » Sat May 18, 2019 9:55 pm

lexingtonhr wrote:
Noobmaster69 wrote:Passed on second try. First time i self studied for 50 days using adaptibar and barbri mini conviser. Second time I studied for 80 days using Themis and critical pass flash cards. Worked ft during both times. As someone with zero knowledge in us law prior to this whole process, I say really put in the time to study.
Were you close to the passing score the first time? I am debating on whether or not I want to take Themis. I took Barbri the first time, and took this private bar company the second time. I'm working right now, but did not work the first two times.
Scored 1361 on my first try. I don't think that is close to passing. All my essays were in the 50 to 65 range (which I was fine with). My main problem was that I did not understand the MBE subjects (scored at 42%tile with crim/civil at around 15%).

On my second try, my strategy was to focus on the MBE subjects + Professional Responsibility/Ethics. MBE subjects weighs 50% of the CBX; out of the 5 essays, 2 will likely be MBE subjects (this was true in 2019 Feb and I think 2018 Jul) and most likely, one will be PR/Ethics. I took this approach and only studied CA subjects with the goal of scoring 55/60 on CA essays. It was a bit of gamble but it worked for me in 2019 Feb CBX, despite having totally panicked on that CP/Wills essay, missed a huge chunk on Real Property, mumbled on PR/Ethics and ran out of time on PT.

If you had taken barprep courses already, I don't think you need another one. If your score is close to passing, I think you were doing everything right and just got unlucky. I would just keep doing whatever you were doing and memorize more law. If you score is not close to passing, try to figure out which area you can most readily improve. For most people, I think this should be MBE, instead of essay questions. The effort required to move an essay grade from say 65 to 70 is taxing, compared to getting 2 to 3 more MBE questions right.

Hope my 2 cent is helpful to someone.

sala5150

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by sala5150 » Sat May 18, 2019 11:21 pm

annej24 wrote:Alright panicking and too nervous to check still.. do you type in your applicant ID and File number exactly as it appears on badge? Like no extra zeros or anything. I am completely overthinking at this point but do not want to accidentally put it in wrong
I had four zeros leading my application number and I did not put those in. You only need the first non zero digits I believe

hastingsgal

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by hastingsgal » Sun May 19, 2019 12:47 am

nowyouscantleave wrote:
Pema wrote:Does anyone have articulable recommendations for scoring 70's uniformly on the essays regardless of the subject? Thanks.
This sounds tedious but what you can do is go through every single sample answer provided by the course you took, pull out all the rules from every essay and organize it in a document in the order that corresponds to the course outline.
Then, go through every single sample answer on a given subject and outline it. You’ll start to see a pattern for questions and how issues are asked together, basically only the facts will vary. Once you know all the possible structure types and have all the possible rules to plug in, it should be easier to tackle any essay without surprises.
One thing I would add - the course sample answers were not helpful to me because they throw in every issue in the book, ones you would never be expected to hit. I think its more helpful to look at real answers that scored 70 like on BarEssays and see which issues have in common. You are aiming to write a 65+ not a course model answer.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by cherrytee » Sun May 19, 2019 12:51 am

Pema wrote:Does anyone have articulable recommendations for scoring 70's uniformly on the essays regardless of the subject? Thanks.

Yes. I did one trick on my third try, July 2018, for my CP essay. It was something I noticed that I did that was different from all of my other essays and essays in previous attempts. When I got my results back, I realized that not only was the conclusion of my essay (for the biggest issue) the complete opposite of that of the two model answers, but the analysis was also completely off as well. However, I got a 70 on the first read and the reread. I repeat. I literally wrote the exact opposite essay in analysis and conclusion from that of the model answers and got a 70, twice.

As I said earlier in this thread, everything changed about my 4th attempt. In prep, mentality, and execution.

One of those changes was to integrate what I did in the July 2018 CP Essay for 4 of the 6 essays this round.

Of course, now that I passed, I can't "prove" that that did the trick. I also did 1000 adaptibar MBE's, used JD advising's MBE guide, read through literally every single flashcard from smartbarprep, which highly improved my already passing previous MBE attempts by 8-10 raw score points, easily.


But this one essay tweak is still BY FAR the most concrete thing I can say that was different in the execution of the test itself, notwithstanding the better studying.




Anyone who failed multiple times can PM me and I'd be super happy to share what I did. Especially those who are about to be fired for failing twice or three times, or is thinking about giving it all up, or both. I SWEAR to you it is worth staying and taking another stab.
Last edited by cherrytee on Sun May 19, 2019 1:13 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by Tapps8 » Sun May 19, 2019 1:14 am

Passed. Second try. This was one hell of a test, that's for sure. I did the Themis program the first time and was unsuccessful. The second time, I used Themis to help outline my study schedule, outlines, graded essays, and for the MBE questions. I did not sit through any of the lectures, and I did not spend time reading the big outlines. From my fail letter last July, I knew I needed to take the essay portion more seriously. I bought the California Bar Essay subscription. I attribute that service to my passing. I downloaded the one-sheeters and used those as an issue guide. I went through every issue on the one-sheeters and memorized the rule. It was a slog but, it was doable. Good luck to all who are going through this.

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rcharter1978

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by rcharter1978 » Sun May 19, 2019 1:52 am

Ciedam08 wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
lexingtonhr wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:Congrats to those who passed! Its fun to re-live the feeling through you guys.

For those who didn't pass, you can do it. Take the weekend, be mad, angry, frustrated and approach it with a clear mind on Monday. And then it's time to talk about scores, strategies and weak spots.
Did you have a tutor when you took the exam again?
Yes, I got a tutor and passed the second time.

But I absolutely needed one. The written portion was my kryptonite.
Do you mind sharing what tutor you used. Or have any suggestions on a reputable tutor? I definitely am needing a tutor this time! These application fees are ridiculous, so I need to make sure this next time is my last!
I used Patrick Lin out if so cal. He is a former bar grader and that was really important to me.

He is an acquired taste for sure...no sugar coating ever at all. And I wouldn't particularly use him for BLL, but overall he was good and was able to give me actionable advice about essay writing that helped me. He also had a really good PT lecture/method (for my PTs I used his method and the one in the Mary basilisk book, and I'm positive that my PTs were pretty good).

There are three former bar graders I know of that tutor. Two in northern California and Patrick in so. Cal. I was all ready to sign up with one of the nor.cal tutors because he was really nice. His program was like 5000. By the time I tried to sign up, he was full.

So I ended up with Patrick, who isn't as nice, but his program was 1/2 the price for more services. I think Patrick gave feedback and grading on more essays and I know he spent like twice the time on phone/Skype tutoring sessions which was nice. He would send back reviewed essays with notes and grades and then you could have an hour session with him to discuss them or anything else. He could also grade essays on the fly, which I really liked because it helped me to understand just how little time the graders have with each essay and the factors they consider.

The other writing tutor (the 5k one) only did half an hour phone sessions.

BUT, if you like sugar coating (and I normally do) or if you want a tutor for BLL, he may not be the right fit. However, I was happy with his program (of course if I hadn't passed I might feel differently!).

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by devastated_examinee » Sun May 19, 2019 2:08 am

Damn, failed. Congrats to those who passed. Nearly 70% do not have the required minimum competence that is needed to practice law in California? I don't know about that one. I am sure everybody would like to know how the graders are really grading our exams at $3.25 an essay. But then again, graders have no incentive to increase the chances of people passing. If they did, it would create more attorneys along with more competition for them and every other attorney in California, which I'm sure is something they are trying to avoid. Oh, and we can't forget about licensed attorneys who have also failed because apparently they also lack the minimum competence to become California attorneys, but are competent to practice in another state. Quite an interesting business practice.

I have also seen scores from people who have received a second read on their essays. There is some substantial inconsistencies with grading. One essay received a 70 on the first read and a 55 on a second read. The amount of money they rake in every year from both the Baby Bar and the Bar Exam, would make one think that they would make an effort to hire professional graders with some consistency. I guess that would just make too much sense.
Last edited by devastated_examinee on Sun May 19, 2019 2:15 am, edited 1 time in total.

Pema

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Re: 2019 February California Bar

Post by Pema » Sun May 19, 2019 2:11 am

cherrytee wrote:
Pema wrote:Does anyone have articulable recommendations for scoring 70's uniformly on the essays regardless of the subject? Thanks.

Yes. I did one trick on my third try, July 2018, for my CP essay. It was something I noticed that I did that was different from all of my other essays and essays in previous attempts. When I got my results back, I realized that not only was the conclusion of my essay (for the biggest issue) the complete opposite of that of the two model answers, but the analysis was also completely off as well. However, I got a 70 on the first read and the reread. I repeat. I literally wrote the exact opposite essay in analysis and conclusion from that of the model answers and got a 70, twice.

One of those changes was to integrate what I did in the July 2018 CP Essay for 4 of the 6 essays this round.
.

Hi. Just looking for clarification:

"the conclusion of my essay (for the biggest issue) the complete opposite of that of the two model answers, but the analysis was also completely off as well"

This is what you did differently on the CP Q and it worked so you used it to pass the next time? I'm not sure what you did exactly. Do you mean you answered the questions counter intuitively? What do you mean your analysis was off? Meaning it was incorrect as well as your conclusion? How would you know real time if you were right or wrong? Still don't know why either of those would change your score. Am I missing something? Thanks.

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