2018 July California Bar

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lnu1992

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby lnu1992 » Wed Sep 12, 2018 6:52 pm

frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

Happy88

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby Happy88 » Sun Sep 16, 2018 2:30 pm

lnu1992 wrote:
frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

The NCBE posted the mean scores. http://www.ncbex.org/news/july-2018-ave ... -decrease/

139.5 average score. I’m freaking out right now.

Nightcrawler

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby Nightcrawler » Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:01 pm

Happy88 wrote:
lnu1992 wrote:
frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

The NCBE posted the mean scores. http://www.ncbex.org/news/july-2018-ave ... -decrease/

139.5 average score. I’m freaking out right now.


I hate life right now. Another two months of pure hell and uncertainty.

Happy88

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby Happy88 » Mon Sep 17, 2018 1:23 am

Nightcrawler wrote:
Happy88 wrote:
lnu1992 wrote:
frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

The NCBE posted the mean scores. http://www.ncbex.org/news/july-2018-ave ... -decrease/

139.5 average score. I’m freaking out right now.


I hate life right now. Another two months of pure hell and uncertainty.


If the average score is low, does that mean we have a better chance at passing after scaling?

extra.soft

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby extra.soft » Mon Sep 17, 2018 8:04 am

Happy88 wrote:
Nightcrawler wrote:
Happy88 wrote:
lnu1992 wrote:
frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

The NCBE posted the mean scores. http://www.ncbex.org/news/july-2018-ave ... -decrease/

139.5 average score. I’m freaking out right now.


I hate life right now. Another two months of pure hell and uncertainty.


If the average score is low, does that mean we have a better chance at passing after scaling?


My understanding is that the average score is already scaled, i.e. someone with the average score is a few points short of a passing grade in CA and will need above average essays to pass.

frqw9201

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby frqw9201 » Mon Sep 17, 2018 9:49 am

Happy88 wrote:
Nightcrawler wrote:
Happy88 wrote:
lnu1992 wrote:
frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

The NCBE posted the mean scores. http://www.ncbex.org/news/july-2018-ave ... -decrease/

139.5 average score. I’m freaking out right now.


I hate life right now. Another two months of pure hell and uncertainty.


If the average score is low, does that mean we have a better chance at passing after scaling?


No the essay scores are scaled using the mbe average your essay score is something like this : (MBE AVERAGE) + (YOUR ESSAY SCORE)*(SOME SCALING MULTIPLE based on the variance of scores) so if mbe mean is low then everyones essay scores will be lower

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MBernard

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby MBernard » Mon Sep 17, 2018 11:38 am

I wouldn’t be freaked out over the low MBE mean. I took the test in Feb. 2018 when the average was like 134 and still managed to score into the 150s. If you tested well on your MBE assessments (Adaptibar, Barbri, etc.) you probably have nothing to worry about. Hold tight gang, almost there.

frqw9201

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby frqw9201 » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:11 pm

MBernard wrote:I wouldn’t be freaked out over the low MBE mean. I took the test in Feb. 2018 when the average was like 134 and still managed to score into the 150s. If you tested well on your MBE assessments (Adaptibar, Barbri, etc.) you probably have nothing to worry about. Hold tight gang, almost there.


february and july scales are different

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a male human

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby a male human » Mon Sep 17, 2018 12:29 pm

frqw9201 wrote:
Happy88 wrote:
Nightcrawler wrote:
Happy88 wrote:
lnu1992 wrote:
frqw9201 wrote:
scard wrote:Anyone know when the ncbe release the mean mbe scores?

February 2018 mean was released mid april, so around 7-8 weeks. It has now been 6 weeks since the July exam.


What does it mean if the mean is high verses when it is low? what is better for recent bar takers?

The NCBE posted the mean scores. http://www.ncbex.org/news/july-2018-ave ... -decrease/

139.5 average score. I’m freaking out right now.


I hate life right now. Another two months of pure hell and uncertainty.


If the average score is low, does that mean we have a better chance at passing after scaling?


No the essay scores are scaled using the mbe average your essay score is something like this : (MBE AVERAGE) + (YOUR ESSAY SCORE)*(SOME SCALING MULTIPLE based on the variance of scores) so if mbe mean is low then everyones essay scores will be lower


To clarify, while your overall composite score (the one you want to get 1440 on) is based on your scaled MBE score and your scaled written score, your scaled written score is completely independent of your MBE performance and is based on other scaling factors.

Your scaled MBE score is theoretically equivalent to the same scaled MBE score from other administrations. If the average score was low, it means the MBE was relatively easier than other exams. Think of it this way: Let's say getting 125 Qs right translates to a 144(0) one year and 150(0) another year. Which one was the harder exam? The latter. Which was easier? The former.

At least that's how I see it. So, as long as you did well, you will score well -- just like any other year.

plstre

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby plstre » Mon Sep 17, 2018 7:54 pm

Althink wrote:I have been practicing law for 11 years, attended a top 5 Law school and currently work at a Big Law firm. I took the CA Bar exam in Feb 18 and did not pass. Granted, I did not have a chance to study for the month and a half right before the exam because of working 80 hour weeks, but I still had a little time to study and decided to take it since I paid for the exam. The only way that I can transfer at my job to it’s CA office is if I am licensed in cA (and I just got engaged....fiancé lives in CA)! I took the full exam rather than the Attorney’s Exam since my MBE scores were strong when I took the bar exam in 2007 and I passed without studying for the essays. Although I did not have a chance to really study for the Ca bar because of work, I am so glad that I sat for the Feb exam! I was able to gain insight into what the exam is actually like and what is needed to pass.

The CA Bar exam lives up to its reputation....you cannot wing this exam. You really have to learn how to take it. In my opinion, as a practicing attorney, it does not test minimum competency at all. Very successful attorneys at my current firm failed the Feb 18 exam. However, if you want to practice in CA, as I do, you must pass it.

I decided to retake and sit for the July 18 Bar exam. I worked full time while studying, but this time I did things differently. First, I decided to take the Attorneys Exam and I focused on really learning how to write the essays and focus on how CA essays are structured. I really put my all into this exam and hope I had enough time to study and pass it this around. I hand wrote the exam, so I could not go deep with my analysis and there were tricky parts to some questions that were much harder than the tests of past years. I don’t care what anyone says, the exam is definitely getting harder each year and February exams are harder.

This time around, I read Mary Basick’s CA Bar Essays and book and used Bar Essays. These two resources taught me how to take the CA Bar exam.....I have a fighting chance of passing because of these two resources. I have learned with standardized tests, it’s all about learning how to master the exam. CA Bar is no different, but it is definitely a beast!

I am very nervous and keep replaying in my mind where I know I missed an issue and could have made a stronger analysis. The Con law question freaked me out, but I identified the causes of actions (privileges and immunities, dormant clause, sovereign immunity, due process, equal protection)-at least I hope that’s right, but just couldn’t remember the exceptions to all of the rules. The exchange between the parties in the Contracts question was difficult for me to analyze in a short amount of time, but I did the best that I could. In real life, you actually have time to think about the issues and research the law!

So frustrating that my fate depends on passing this exam...my job, living in the same state as my fiancé...it’s like my life is on hold until I pass this thing. The thought of retaking it scares me like crazy Bc it sucks so much out of you! Good luck to everyone! Just know if you are a retaker, this exam does not measure the kind of lawyer you will/can be! I am living proof of this....I’m one hell of a corporate attorney!

Praying for good results of Pass in November....I really have my all this time around!


In Feb 18 were you in Pasadena a couple tables away from the coughing person? I think I might have been sitting next to you. If so, sorry to hear about the bad break.

What'sUP?

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby What'sUP? » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:00 pm

Does anyone know if failing to write an "Introduction" on the PT is a fatal error?

What'sUP?

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby What'sUP? » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:13 pm

And, was one required on this past exam? Have totally forgotten.

lnu1992

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby lnu1992 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:37 pm

What'sUP? wrote:Does anyone know if failing to write an "Introduction" on the PT is a fatal error?


I did not write Introduction. From what I remember, the main call of the assignment was to draft an Argument section.

estefanchanning

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby estefanchanning » Tue Sep 18, 2018 1:31 pm

lnu1992 wrote:
What'sUP? wrote:Does anyone know if failing to write an "Introduction" on the PT is a fatal error?


I did not write Introduction. From what I remember, the main call of the assignment was to draft an Argument section.


From what I recall, the call of the question specifically asked you to omit a facts/intro section.

JohnnieSockran

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby JohnnieSockran » Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:46 pm

When are the results scheduled to be released, out of curiosity?

What'sUP?

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby What'sUP? » Tue Sep 18, 2018 6:47 pm

estefanchanning wrote:
lnu1992 wrote:
What'sUP? wrote:Does anyone know if failing to write an "Introduction" on the PT is a fatal error?


I did not write Introduction. From what I remember, the main call of the assignment was to draft an Argument section.


From what I recall, the call of the question specifically asked you to omit a facts/intro section.


Thanks guys :) For some reason, I could not at all remember what the Task asked for.

estefanchanning

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby estefanchanning » Tue Sep 18, 2018 7:11 pm

JohnnieSockran wrote:When are the results scheduled to be released, out of curiosity?


2020 :roll:

lnu1992

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby lnu1992 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:14 am

https://abovethelaw.com/2018/09/mbe-sco ... -year-low/

Written component is tracking MBE low mean. :(

longwait

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby longwait » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:37 pm

JohnnieSockran wrote:When are the results scheduled to be released, out of curiosity?

November 16th :(

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MBernard

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby MBernard » Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:57 pm

Anyone going to start preemptively studying while they’re waiting for the results? I’m considering starting either in October or November. There was an essay I know botched hard (Evidence) which is bugging me. Plus other minor essay errors. Felt good when I left but good grief the waiting process is such a bummer lol

lnu1992

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby lnu1992 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 5:45 pm

MBernard wrote:Anyone going to start preemptively studying while they’re waiting for the results? I’m considering starting either in October or November. There was an essay I know botched hard (Evidence) which is bugging me. Plus other minor essay errors. Felt good when I left but good grief the waiting process is such a bummer lol



Nope. I am keeping concepts fresh in my brain but not going to study. Having faith. I also felt horrible about Evidence and Community Property. The PT was also weird and who knows about the MBE. We are all in the same boat. Hoping to beat the odds.

justanotheruser

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby justanotheruser » Fri Sep 21, 2018 6:44 pm

MBernard wrote:Anyone going to start preemptively studying while they’re waiting for the results? I’m considering starting either in October or November. There was an essay I know botched hard (Evidence) which is bugging me. Plus other minor essay errors. Felt good when I left but good grief the waiting process is such a bummer lol


Multiple repeater here who just passed the Feb 2018 exam after failing 5 times.

FWIW, I debated this same issue, but I ended up starting my studies again around mid-December.

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MBernard

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby MBernard » Fri Sep 21, 2018 9:44 pm

Thanks for the input guys. I guess I’ll just chill and if anything I’ll do some light reading of my notes but nothing serious (no essays or MBEs).

mathandthelaw

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby mathandthelaw » Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:38 pm

How I feel about my performance on the bar without discussing the actual content of any question:

Essays:
-Overall think they went well. I think I killed contracts/remedies and actually even went above and beyond because it was actually a pretty narrow question. Evidence I think I passed. PR I think I killed. Community property I messed up one of the rules but I think that is salvageable considering I got the rest of them. Con law I think I did well on.

PT:
-Honestly, I think I could have done better with more time even though I had an hour and forty five minutes which was usually enough time for me. I regret not doing the PT first, but I looked at the essays and I was like, I know these rules I need to bust them out right now before I forget anything.
-I got the main gist of it. I just felt like I was making the same arguments for both prongs. Didn't conclude at all, just ended each topic. That will cost me a bit.
-The client was not the easiest client to be convincing of, but that's the legal profession sometimes.
-Spent too much time coming up with good headings, hopefully they were actually goods. Headings are important not just for PTs but for practice.
-I thought it was one of the hardest PTs I had done, and I actually practiced a lot of PTs because they were worth double the essays and I didn't want to take it for granted. I didn't care that I CALI'd/AMJUR'd all my legal writing courses, because I had way more time to do those obviously.

MBE:
-No idea, it is really hard to say. I felt like many of those questions I just had to pick what I thought was the best answer and I just didn't know after analyzing.
-Civ pro questions were strange because a lot of important topics I knew so well were not asked. That was a bummer. I hope I got those lawerly questions right, I feel like I did.
-Property questions imo were really hard. Lots of mortgages questions but I thought I knew mortgages but was not ready for those questions.
-Crim pro was harder than I thought because there were some obscure questions I hadn't really tested myself on. Crim was okay I think.
-Evidence was okay, can't say I remember too much, other than thinking it was hard. Was never great at evidence but I improved significantly closer to the actual exam, which makes me feel better about it.
-Contracts is an area where I usually excel in because I love contracts, but I don't remember the questions. I just remember feeling like there were a lot.
-Torts I really cannot remember for the life of me.
-I finished 20 minutes early for both sessions and I am a medium-slow reader (because I like to underline and utilize active reading because that helps me for some reason). I went back to the questions that I remember I just put an answer for and moved on because I had no idea and was guestimating. I changed only one or two answers but ran out of time before I could review the like 20 questions in each session I guestimated. That's why I always bubble something lightly before I move on so I don't miss it in case I run too close for time. In the very last two-three minutes I double checked all my bubbles to make sure they correspond with the questions and that my bubbling/erasing was good enough.

Hope I passed. Literally have NO clue! My PT, which was a strength for me going into it, ended up not being a strength, which puts more pressure for me on the essays/MBE. Hope I passed the PT. MBEs I just have absolutely no idea, I was usually doing above average on practice ones. Essays I feel pretty good about but you never know.

I definitely studied harder than most people I talked to. I just hope it was all worth the time and everything I did was efficient.

Good luck all!

JoeSeperac

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Re: 2018 July California Bar

Postby JoeSeperac » Wed Oct 03, 2018 2:32 pm

Here is a graph of the CA July pass rates from 1995 to 2017 as compared to the national MBE mean. As you can see, the CA pass rates move more smoothly than the MBE mean, so hopefully any decline follows that behavior. You have to love the 63% pass rate in 1997 with an MBE mean of 143.9 versus the 62% pass rate in 2008 despite the ridiculously high MBE mean of 145.6

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