California Bar Moral Character Application

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InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 12:55 pm

FinallyPassedTheBar wrote:
InterAlia1961 wrote:
FinallyPassedTheBar wrote:From what I have read, an applicant's "performance" is a crucial component of the informal interview process. It's similar to an attorney training a witness to perform on the stand. Truth is not enough. One must also convey the truth in a convincing manner. The C&F attorneys have special insight into this because many of them are former CA Bar employees who previously conducted C&F hearings.


Could you share your sources? I'm always looking for information on the informal hearing.


I don't remember the exact reddit sub where I read that, but you can get a general feel here: https://www.reddit.com/r/LawSchool/sear ... trict_sr=1


Thanks. It was helpful.

InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 1:01 pm

bacillusanthracis wrote:
A big part of my holdup is that I'm older. I owned a couple of business which lasted 3 and 14 years respectively, which means I've sued people and have been sued (all contract stuff/no tort). I've been divorced and had a custody battle. My mom died and we had to sue the executor.

I provided them with about a hundred pages of materials, which didn't include the moral character application itself. So I do understand to some degree why they're taking longer than average. But it's been a year now. I think that's enough.


Have you tried to contact them at all? Did you pass the bar exam yet? A year seems excessive where there's no criminal conviction. As for the legal actions, the investigation should be pretty straight forward. Did they ask you to provide any docs from the cases you were involved in?

There was a meeting of the moral character subcommittee on Friday and Saturday. Happens every other month. If you're going to hear something after this meeting, it'll be before the next scheduled meeting in October. Good luck.

bacillusanthracis

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby bacillusanthracis » Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:53 am

InterAlia1961 wrote:
bacillusanthracis wrote:
A big part of my holdup is that I'm older. I owned a couple of business which lasted 3 and 14 years respectively, which means I've sued people and have been sued (all contract stuff/no tort). I've been divorced and had a custody battle. My mom died and we had to sue the executor.

I provided them with about a hundred pages of materials, which didn't include the moral character application itself. So I do understand to some degree why they're taking longer than average. But it's been a year now. I think that's enough.


Have you tried to contact them at all? Did you pass the bar exam yet? A year seems excessive where there's no criminal conviction. As for the legal actions, the investigation should be pretty straight forward. Did they ask you to provide any docs from the cases you were involved in?

There was a meeting of the moral character subcommittee on Friday and Saturday. Happens every other month. If you're going to hear something after this meeting, it'll be before the next scheduled meeting in October. Good luck.


When you've been involved in past legal proceedings, either civil or criminal, they ask you for certain documentation, which I did provide, and which is why I had to submit almost a hundred pages of material to them. So like I said, I understand that mine would take longer than most.

And the only saving grace to this is that no, I haven't passed the bar exam yet, so it's not hurting me. But come November, if it turns out I did pass, then this becomes an enormous issue for me. In the meantime though, I see no reason to contact them--no reason to stir a potential hornet's nest. I get letters from them every so often that let me know the investigation is ongoing, and they haven't just forgotten about me.

But having to gather all that old stuff up and give it to some committee to review is an incredibly invasive experience. My divorce, my kids, my mom's death, my business dealings. Having to relive all of that was an experience I could've done without. We necessarily leave things behind in order to be able to cope with the present, and to dredge it all back up again knocked me into a pretty nasty depressive state. Truly, the moral app committee has in their hands the most traumatic things I've ever experienced.

I really didn't know they were going to ask for all that. Before I signed up for law school, I did ask about the moral character app because I had a DUI. I was told not to worry about it as long as it was the only thing, and that I'd never been sued for fraud, had a felony, or something like that. I suppose I could've done a hardcore internet search and found out different, but I gave it the same level of concern the person I spoke with at school did.

Well, I will find out what happens. I guess.

estefanchanning

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby estefanchanning » Tue Aug 28, 2018 2:48 pm

bacillusanthracis wrote:
InterAlia1961 wrote:
bacillusanthracis wrote:
A big part of my holdup is that I'm older. I owned a couple of business which lasted 3 and 14 years respectively, which means I've sued people and have been sued (all contract stuff/no tort). I've been divorced and had a custody battle. My mom died and we had to sue the executor.

I provided them with about a hundred pages of materials, which didn't include the moral character application itself. So I do understand to some degree why they're taking longer than average. But it's been a year now. I think that's enough.


Have you tried to contact them at all? Did you pass the bar exam yet? A year seems excessive where there's no criminal conviction. As for the legal actions, the investigation should be pretty straight forward. Did they ask you to provide any docs from the cases you were involved in?

There was a meeting of the moral character subcommittee on Friday and Saturday. Happens every other month. If you're going to hear something after this meeting, it'll be before the next scheduled meeting in October. Good luck.


When you've been involved in past legal proceedings, either civil or criminal, they ask you for certain documentation, which I did provide, and which is why I had to submit almost a hundred pages of material to them. So like I said, I understand that mine would take longer than most.

And the only saving grace to this is that no, I haven't passed the bar exam yet, so it's not hurting me. But come November, if it turns out I did pass, then this becomes an enormous issue for me. In the meantime though, I see no reason to contact them--no reason to stir a potential hornet's nest. I get letters from them every so often that let me know the investigation is ongoing, and they haven't just forgotten about me.

But having to gather all that old stuff up and give it to some committee to review is an incredibly invasive experience. My divorce, my kids, my mom's death, my business dealings. Having to relive all of that was an experience I could've done without. We necessarily leave things behind in order to be able to cope with the present, and to dredge it all back up again knocked me into a pretty nasty depressive state. Truly, the moral app committee has in their hands the most traumatic things I've ever experienced.

I really didn't know they were going to ask for all that. Before I signed up for law school, I did ask about the moral character app because I had a DUI. I was told not to worry about it as long as it was the only thing, and that I'd never been sued for fraud, had a felony, or something like that. I suppose I could've done a hardcore internet search and found out different, but I gave it the same level of concern the person I spoke with at school did.

Well, I will find out what happens. I guess.


I get what you're saying re: hornet's nest, but if you haven't reached out to them in a year, I would definitely reach out to them. I had 2 lawsuits to report, among other things, yet I was cleared within 6 months.

I would call and be straight up with them. Why is it taking one year, what is the hold up, and when should you contact them again.

I read some horror stories about some analysts here, but frankly my analyst was a straight shooter (and I think most analysts are). So if it's been one year, they'd understand. You're right in that if you don't pass the bar, they will likely put you on the back burner, but that doesn't justify a *one year* delay.

a corsair

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby a corsair » Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:48 pm

Just adding my timeline for people in the future:

Dec 2017: submitted application

Mar 2018: email stating that initial processing has been completed and 180 days required to complete processing

June 2018: called to ask for status update; transferred to analyst voicemail and left a message. Analyst called back and said after a few more weeks they’d have a better idea of if they needed additional information.

One week after that: letter stating that my case had been assigned to an analyst

Two weeks after analyst assigned letter: letter stating that my application would not be completed within standard 180 days and asking additional clarifying questions

One month after letter asking for clarification: notice of good moral character determination

I had one college alcohol incident and one semi-serious academic related violation. Both were already disclosed in law school applications, otherwise I might have been headed to informal hearing. My experience with my analyst was that they were a straight shooter and I’m really glad/lucky to have my application processed so quickly once the ball got rolling. Agree with other posters that if you’ve been waiting for a while you should call and politely ask for an update and if you can provide any additional information. Good luck to everyone still going through the process.

Porkypots

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby Porkypots » Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:01 pm

Anyone deal with anxiety related disclosure issues with the cal bar moral app? Should you disclose that you have anxiety even if you’ve never been diagnosed but have been prescribed medication (for that particular instance)?

dabigchina

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby dabigchina » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:50 am

Hmm I got that "your initial processing is finished' email. I hope my application isn't going to get delayed a year/fucked.

InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Fri Sep 14, 2018 11:31 am

dabigchina wrote:Hmm I got that "your initial processing is finished' email. I hope my application isn't going to get delayed a year/fucked.


If you have a blemish, there will likely be a delay. Read for the thread for some examples. Good luck.

Underoath

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby Underoath » Fri Sep 14, 2018 12:28 pm

dabigchina wrote:Hmm I got that "your initial processing is finished' email. I hope my application isn't going to get delayed a year/fucked.


Was that at the 6 month mark?

patiently_waiting

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby patiently_waiting » Fri Sep 14, 2018 2:15 pm

dabigchina wrote:Hmm I got that "your initial processing is finished' email. I hope my application isn't going to get delayed a year/fucked.


I got this email back at the end of march... and i am still waiting... my 180 day mark is coming up soon and im not sure what is going on. I have not received any correspondence from them and I don't have anything in my background that would result in holding up my application.

Im not sure if I should call my analyst now... or wait till the 180th day and call and check.

dabigchina

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby dabigchina » Fri Sep 14, 2018 3:36 pm

Underoath wrote:
dabigchina wrote:Hmm I got that "your initial processing is finished' email. I hope my application isn't going to get delayed a year/fucked.


Was that at the 6 month mark?

Got mine at the 4 month mark.

InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Thu Sep 20, 2018 12:54 pm

In previous posts, I've seen others complaining that their analyst didn't return their calls. I thought it was odd, because the first time I called, my analyst's assistant called me back the next day. Something has changed, though. I called my analyst and left a message a month ago and then again yesterday. Nothing. Silence. I'm worried that this doesn't bode well for me. So, if anyone has called, not gotten a response, but was ultimately admitted, please let me know. Right now, I'm assuming that the problem I anticipated has arisen, and I have failed to overcome it. (No drugs, alcohol, domestic violence. Other family issues that I didn't handle well resulting in two misdemeanors 13 years ago.) I just want to get the informal hearing over with. I'm convinced that when I meet with the committee, I will be able to prove my rehabilitation to their satisfaction. I'd like to get on with it. I'm at the nine-month mark.

valentina

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby valentina » Thu Sep 20, 2018 5:38 pm

App submitted mid-February and cleared first week in September. No red flags on my app at all. I received one letter mid-August asking for follow up regarding one of my jobs; I called my analyst to talk about it and she said she would clear me as soon as she received my response to her letter. She cleared me the day after she received it. I found her to be extremely personable; I called her several times and each time she picked up the phone herself. Now just waiting on my admissions packet.

Good luck to everyone still going through this, the wait is the hardest part.

kiwh

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby kiwh » Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:45 am

InterAlia, Is there a way to PM you? I have a question for you. I tried to PM but it said I did not have that feature.

InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:16 am

kiwh wrote:InterAlia, Is there a way to PM you? I have a question for you. I tried to PM but it said I did not have that feature.


I PMed you. You should be able to reply. I'm not sure how to turn on the feature on your end.

kiwh

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby kiwh » Fri Sep 21, 2018 11:55 am

It would not let me reply. It says the option is not available because I am to new or don't post enough. Here is an e-mail address I normally do not use. You can e-mail me through here if would like. risknik@sbcglobal.net.

Kim

InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 12:52 pm

kiwh wrote:It would not let me reply. It says the option is not available because I am to new or don't post enough. Here is an e-mail address I normally do not use. You can e-mail me through here if would like. risknik@sbcglobal.net.

Kim


Done. Check for an email from BigMartha@mail.com.

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MBernard

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby MBernard » Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:37 pm

Received confirmation today that my moral character application has been processed and found satisfactory. Filed the app back in mid-June 2018 and took the General Bar Exam (I’m an Attorney applicant). Was worried this would take a lot longer, hope everyone else gets theirs soon as well.

kiwh

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby kiwh » Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:27 am

Congrats MBernard!!

I submitted mid June as well but have not received anything yet. Did you receive anything from them in between filing and approval?

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MBernard

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby MBernard » Sun Sep 30, 2018 2:30 am

kiwh wrote:Congrats MBernard!!

I submitted mid June as well but have not received anything yet. Did you receive anything from them in between filing and approval?


Hey thanks! Yeah, I received a letter from the Bar around mid-September (17th I think). It stated that the determination was ongoing and usually takes 180 days to complete. I think it may have also mentioned that 90 days have elapsed and I was at the halfway point as well. Nothing really that helpful though, I was sure I’d be waiting another 90 days or longer.

Bla Bla Bla Blah

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby Bla Bla Bla Blah » Thu Oct 04, 2018 1:13 pm

MBernard wrote:Received confirmation today that my moral character application has been processed and found satisfactory. Filed the app back in mid-June 2018 and took the General Bar Exam (I’m an Attorney applicant). Was worried this would take a lot longer, hope everyone else gets theirs soon as well.


Wow, incredible! So happy for you. Such a huge slog to be sitting there with the fate of your legal future caught up in this mysterious Moral Character Determination process.

I know you have no way of understanding what went into your process and why it turned out so well... but could you by chance PM me the name of the person who did your review, and the facts that were analyzed? I've posted the details of mine in this thread, but for all intents and purposes, after filing the updated information with the Bar (I had a business reference that was also included as a general) I think they consider mine filed in late April. I hear that who is assigned to your review makes a big difference, so I'm hopeful that the person who processed yours is the same that is working on mine. I have unpaid debts from family law peoceedings that may also hold mine back, but am hoping that this isn't the reason for the hold up.

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MBernard

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby MBernard » Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:28 pm

Bla Bla Bla Blah wrote: Wow, incredible! So happy for you. Such a huge slog to be sitting there with the fate of your legal future caught up in this mysterious Moral Character Determination process.

I know you have no way of understanding what went into your process and why it turned out so well... but could you by chance PM me the name of the person who did your review, and the facts that were analyzed? I've posted the details of mine in this thread, but for all intents and purposes, after filing the updated information with the Bar (I had a business reference that was also included as a general) I think they consider mine filed in late April. I hear that who is assigned to your review makes a big difference, so I'm hopeful that the person who processed yours is the same that is working on mine. I have unpaid debts from family law proceedings that may also hold mine back, but am hoping that this isn't the reason for the hold up.


Sent you a pm.

(For anyone interested) Really only have two theories on why the process was so fast. I think it either had to do with the fact I'm already licensed in TX or maybe sending them the app in tangible paper form somehow expedited the process.

I know the TX Board of Law Examiners sent a certification of good moral standing to the Ca Board on my behalf so maybe they relied heavily on that. Otherwise, maybe they go through the paper apps before the ones done electronically?

Not even sure I'd recommend the paper app approach to other TLS users though. The Ca Board originally claimed they never received either my application or the check I sent. So I went through a whole back and forth with the Los Angeles Office concerning whether or not my application was lost in the mail. This claim made absolutely no sense though, as almost immediately the cashier's check I sent them was cashed by the office of admissions. I called them about three times and then toward the end of the week (Mid June) they told me they found everything. This process was unfortunately more chaotic than the last bar exam I took.

Blueplanet

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby Blueplanet » Sat Oct 06, 2018 4:30 am

The CA Bar are recruiting an Investigator for Moral Character applications. I wonder if they are slow due to being understaffed or whether they are seeking to increase their turnaround time by adding staff. Time will tell. Here's the job advert if anyone wants to give them a hand and apply!

https://www.linkedin.com/jobs/view/859389421/

Bla Bla Bla Blah

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby Bla Bla Bla Blah » Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:22 pm

Blueplanet wrote:The CA Bar are recruiting an Investigator for Moral Character applications. I wonder if they are slow due to being understaffed or whether they are seeking to increase their turnaround time by adding staff. Time will tell. Here's the job advert if anyone wants to give them a hand and apply!

https://www.linkedin.com/jobs/view/859389421/


Honestly, not a bad idea! And you're probably spot on. This LA Times article underscores the CA Bar's modus operandi... which is to short change the Association's primary functions in favor of bloated executive pay and other funding mismanagement.

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-m ... story.html

InterAlia1961

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Re: California Bar Moral Character Application

Postby InterAlia1961 » Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:08 pm

Ugh. I just did a search and found a social media comment that I regret making. No swearing or racial slurs. Just some serious caps and calling someone else a liar and a racist for calling me a liar and a racist. I know the bar saw it. It's two-years old. There's nothing else. The reason I'm asking is I heard from someone who attended the informal conference where they were confronted with a printout of pretty ugly tweets and posts. It took them by surprise, and they immediately denied making them. The meeting didn't go well, and this person doesn't expect to be admitted. If you're worried about something you posted, do a search and see what you find before submitting the C&F app. I should've done it.



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