Page 1 of 3

New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:13 am
by jtp191
http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2017.pdf

When the mean score is low does that decrease the chances of passing?

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:09 am
by yankeeman86
Damn.

Yes, it means the scaled score of your MBE will be lower. It's unfair but if you are part of a pool of applicants that underperformed compared to previous admins, you will need to have answered a higher number of questions than let's say someone in F2014 to receive a similar scaled score.

Bummer.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:23 am
by happyhour1122
jtp191 wrote:http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics/february/f2017.pdf

When the mean score is low does that decrease the chances of passing?



wow...mean MBE is really low...

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:51 am
by Roclandsfinest23
Isn't that only 1 point lower than the 2016 MBE mean?

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:55 am
by happyhour1122
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:Isn't that only 1 point lower than the 2016 MBE mean?


i was comparing with other State average MBE score

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 10:58 am
by Roclandsfinest23
happyhour1122 wrote:
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:Isn't that only 1 point lower than the 2016 MBE mean?


i was comparing with other State average MBE score


Gotcha

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:07 am
by maxmartin
happyhour1122 wrote:
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:Isn't that only 1 point lower than the 2016 MBE mean?


i was comparing with other State average MBE score


Isn't MBE scaled nationally? What does that mean? PA in general bad MBE test takers?

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:10 am
by Roclandsfinest23
maxmartin wrote:
happyhour1122 wrote:
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:Isn't that only 1 point lower than the 2016 MBE mean?


i was comparing with other State average MBE score


Isn't MBE scaled nationally? What does that mean? PA in general bad MBE test takers?


If you click that link above it has the PA MBE mean scores and it also has the national mean of MBE scores

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:46 am
by yankeeman86
maxmartin wrote:
happyhour1122 wrote:
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:Isn't that only 1 point lower than the 2016 MBE mean?


i was comparing with other State average MBE score


Isn't MBE scaled nationally? What does that mean? PA in general bad MBE test takers?


What are you reading. PA did better than the national.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 11:47 am
by yankeeman86
shouldn't matter how your state did. The scaled score as far as I know is based on the national mean. Pass rates will be low for F2017.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 1:23 pm
by Tzhs
yankeeman86 wrote:shouldn't matter how your state did. The scaled score as far as I know is based on the national mean. Pass rates will be low for F2017.


This is dead on, and confirmed by looking at the FL results (released this morning) for Feb '17 versus Feb '16. The FL first time pass rate went down, consistent with the mean scores going down from the prior year.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 1:32 pm
by Roclandsfinest23
Tzhs wrote:
yankeeman86 wrote:shouldn't matter how your state did. The scaled score as far as I know is based on the national mean. Pass rates will be low for F2017.


This is dead on, and confirmed by looking at the FL results (released this morning) for Feb '17 versus Feb '16. The FL first time pass rate went down, consistent with the mean scores going down from the prior year.


Is your username Tappan zee hs?

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 1:36 pm
by Tzhs
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:
Tzhs wrote:
yankeeman86 wrote:shouldn't matter how your state did. The scaled score as far as I know is based on the national mean. Pass rates will be low for F2017.


This is dead on, and confirmed by looking at the FL results (released this morning) for Feb '17 versus Feb '16. The FL first time pass rate went down, consistent with the mean scores going down from the prior year.


Is your username Tappan zee hs?


Assuming that there is a "k" missing from your username! While I took the FL exam last year, I graduated from TZHS many, many years ago.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 1:39 pm
by gboston87
Hey guys, don't freak out just yet. I looked up PA's Feb 2016 results and they are roughly the same as PA's Feb 2017 results.

February 2016
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 136.514
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Total Population (National) : 134.954
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 96.500-178.800
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Total Population (National): 49.500-188.200

February 2017
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 136.147
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Total Population (National) : 134.060
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 89.400-181.000
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Total Population (National): 62.200-187.900

February 2016 - http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2016.pdf
February 2017 - http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2017.pdf

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 1:46 pm
by Roclandsfinest23
Tzhs wrote:
Roclandsfinest23 wrote:
Tzhs wrote:
yankeeman86 wrote:shouldn't matter how your state did. The scaled score as far as I know is based on the national mean. Pass rates will be low for F2017.


This is dead on, and confirmed by looking at the FL results (released this morning) for Feb '17 versus Feb '16. The FL first time pass rate went down, consistent with the mean scores going down from the prior year.


Is your username Tappan zee hs?


Assuming that there is a "k" missing from your username! While I took the FL exam last year, I graduated from TZHS many, many years ago.


Yes there is! lol. Small world. My mother is a teacher at TZHS. Born and raised in rockland

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 10, 2017 2:08 pm
by yankeeman86
gboston87 wrote:Hey guys, don't freak out just yet. I looked up PA's Feb 2016 results and they are roughly the same as PA's Feb 2017 results.

February 2016
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 136.514
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Total Population (National) : 134.954
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 96.500-178.800
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Total Population (National): 49.500-188.200

February 2017
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 136.147
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Total Population (National) : 134.060
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 89.400-181.000
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Total Population (National): 62.200-187.900

February 2016 - http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2016.pdf
February 2017 - http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2017.pdf



I didn't realize F2016 was just as bad. Pass rates should be similar to F2016 then. F2017 and F2016's pass rates are probably lower than F2015 assuming F2015 had a higher national mean score.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 12:24 pm
by JDNE
gboston87 wrote:Hey guys, don't freak out just yet. I looked up PA's Feb 2016 results and they are roughly the same as PA's Feb 2017 results.

February 2016
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 136.514
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Total Population (National) : 134.954
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 96.500-178.800
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Total Population (National): 49.500-188.200

February 2017
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 136.147
Mean MBE Scaled Score for Total Population (National) : 134.060
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Applicants Testing in Pennsylvania: 89.400-181.000
Range of MBE Scaled Scores for Total Population (National): 62.200-187.900

February 2016 - http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2016.pdf
February 2017 - http://www.pabarexam.org/pdf/statistics ... /f2017.pdf


Does anyone know what a 136.147 scaled score even means? As in, how many of the 200 questions were correct to end up with a given scaled score? Or even a raw score? I hate how confusing this all is, and I really have never given it any thought until recently. Thank you in advance.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:06 pm
by jtp191
I don't believe we're ever told what the scale is.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Fri Apr 14, 2017 8:36 pm
by JDNE
jtp191 wrote:I don't believe we're ever told what the scale is.

Thank you. This is that last weekend of waiting for Bar results. I took Massachusetts because my wife has a job there. If I don't pass I'll have to move and study. This last weekend is rough. But I know y'all get it in here. The waiting is the hardest part.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:54 am
by jtp191
JDNE wrote:
jtp191 wrote:I don't believe we're ever told what the scale is.

Thank you. This is that last weekend of waiting for Bar results. I took Massachusetts because my wife has a job there. If I don't pass I'll have to move and study. This last weekend is rough. But I know y'all get it in here. The waiting is the hardest part.


You're welcome. I am also waiting on Mass, best of luck to you.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 1:39 pm
by gboston87
jtp191 wrote:
JDNE wrote:
jtp191 wrote:I don't believe we're ever told what the scale is.

Thank you. This is that last weekend of waiting for Bar results. I took Massachusetts because my wife has a job there. If I don't pass I'll have to move and study. This last weekend is rough. But I know y'all get it in here. The waiting is the hardest part.


You're welcome. I am also waiting on Mass, best of luck to you.


Me three.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:04 pm
by JDNE
jtp191 wrote:You're welcome. I am also waiting on Mass, best of luck to you.

gboston87 wrote:Me three.

I'm thinking of you both this weekend. I have to travel on the 19th, of all days, but I'll check email at some point and update y'all. You're both in my thoughts. I hope everyone in here passed so we can all get on with our lives.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Sat Apr 15, 2017 6:58 pm
by JoeSeperac
A 1 point drop in MBE mean is pretty significant. It will probably lead to overall pass rates being less than 50% nationally. Following are national pass rates in February sorted by MBE mean:

http://seperac.com/image/Seperac%20Screenshot-067.png

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 9:35 am
by InterAlia1961
Does anyone know what a 136.147 scaled score even means? As in, how many of the 200 questions were correct to end up with a given scaled score? Or even a raw score? I hate how confusing this all is, and I really have never given it any thought until recently. Thank you in advance.[/quote]

According to my math, it comes to 119 correct questions. Here's how I got there. I divided 200, the number of questions that actually appear on the test, by 175, the number of questions that actually count. Carrying it out three digits, I got 1.142 as the value of each question, presuming they are equally weighted, which I doubt. Then, I divided 136.147 by 1.142 and got 119 and change. If this is correct, then to get to the 144 cut score in CA, you would've had to answer 127 correct.

Re: New Low For February Bar takers

Posted: Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:09 am
by happyhour1122
taking 25 questions out is just unfair. We had more opportunities to get it right!
Since we don't get any scores taken off from getting the questions wrong, I still we had more chance of gaining more points by solving more questions. I don't know how this isn't going to make any difference..