Top Law Schools

Goes to show you how every #5pointsmatter.

1432 (1438 before re-grade) -- is what it is.

For those who have re-taken, how long did it take you to get back to speed -- I feel rusty as hell.

TFALAWL wrote:1432 (1438 before re-grade) -- is what it is.

For those who have re-taken, how long did it take you to get back to speed -- I feel rusty as hell.

Not long. You remember more than you realize.

The biggest tip that I have is REST this week. Don't open your books. After my first fail, I was mentally and emotionally exhausted. I couldn't focus on the questions. It's difficult, but the best thing is to go into this with a relaxed and positive outlook.

If anyone is looking for a good deal on Barbri books (July 2016/February 2017), shoot me a PM. Outline books (CA, Multi-state, Conviser) are all pristine, essay book has some very light chicken-scratch notes on half of the prompts, MBE book pages are about 90% clean, CPT book pages are about 90% clean, lecture book has all blanks filled in already. Not looking to play games with price-maximization, just trying to offload to first reasonable offer. Pics available via PM as well.

a male human wrote:

ArtistOfManliness wrote:Anyone have a reservoir of differences between CA law and UBE-land law for the subjects that overlap? (whatever those might be... I've been delaying studying)

Is Prof. Resp. a UBE subject?

It's not

ArtistOfManliness wrote:

a male human wrote:

ArtistOfManliness wrote:Anyone have a reservoir of differences between CA law and UBE-land law for the subjects that overlap? (whatever those might be... I've been delaying studying)

Is Prof. Resp. a UBE subject?

It's not

Ah damn, I have a table of differences between CA and ABA rules.

I think the only MBE (and UBE?) subjects with split laws are Civ Pro and Evidence.

a male human wrote:

ArtistOfManliness wrote:

a male human wrote:

ArtistOfManliness wrote:Anyone have a reservoir of differences between CA law and UBE-land law for the subjects that overlap? (whatever those might be... I've been delaying studying)

Is Prof. Resp. a UBE subject?

It's not

Ah damn, I have a table of differences between CA and ABA rules.

I think the only MBE (and UBE?) subjects with split laws are Civ Pro and Evidence.

Ah, that makes studying a little easier. But how does TLS not have google docs with the differences?

ArtistOfManliness wrote:

a male human wrote:

ArtistOfManliness wrote:

a male human wrote:

ArtistOfManliness wrote:Anyone have a reservoir of differences between CA law and UBE-land law for the subjects that overlap? (whatever those might be... I've been delaying studying)

Is Prof. Resp. a UBE subject?

It's not

Ah damn, I have a table of differences between CA and ABA rules.

I think the only MBE (and UBE?) subjects with split laws are Civ Pro and Evidence.

Ah, that makes studying a little easier. But how does TLS not have google docs with the differences?

They probably just get buried in the threads even if they're posted

F#$%. Now that reality is setting in and I have to start thinking about February...

For successful applicants, what are your thoughts on using a tutor? I relied almost exclusively on Barbri, crushed the completion percentage, and had almost no doubt I'd be on the pass list on my first attempt.

Is a tutor just a lazy way to get around being proactive about tailoring my study approach? Is there some legitimate value added? I can't go through this for a third time.

juristudent wrote:F#$%. Now that reality is setting in and I have to start thinking about February...

For successful applicants, what are your thoughts on using a tutor? I relied almost exclusively on Barbri, crushed the completion percentage, and had almost no doubt I'd be on the pass list on my first attempt.

Is a tutor just a lazy way to get around being proactive about tailoring my study approach? Is there some legitimate value added? I can't go through this for a third time.

I recommend here.
I would not have passed without him.
http://www.bestbarsuccess.com

It is a lot of work with personal one on one grading and help.
You really benefit from the same person grading your essays and seeing your consistent areas of problems.

The flash card system, keyed to answers, is so helpful.

It is massive. It is work. It makes the difference.

juristudent wrote:F#$%. Now that reality is setting in and I have to start thinking about February...

For successful applicants, what are your thoughts on using a tutor? I relied almost exclusively on Barbri, crushed the completion percentage, and had almost no doubt I'd be on the pass list on my first attempt.

Is a tutor just a lazy way to get around being proactive about tailoring my study approach? Is there some legitimate value added? I can't go through this for a third time.

I have not used a tutor so I can't say one way or another, but many others recommend one.

Just my personal opinion but I think a tutor is similar to a "big box" company in that you're just following someone else's path instead of being proactive about your own study approach like you suggest. Almost by definition, you have to be serious about taking this other person's path; otherwise you're wasting a lot of money.

The good part is that they will review your work and give you pointers. It's a valid shortcut if that's what you want. I happen to think it's better to self-evaluate by seeing real answers and impossible model answers and comparing it (and understanding explanations for MBE questions). That is, you're extracting lessons yourself (and better absorbed) instead of being spoonfed with them. But probably better to get a tutor to point it out if you can't tell what's good about a good essay in the first place.

It really is up to you. If tailoring your own study approach means a tutor is involved, trust yourself and do it. I think they will be open to hourly billing for a la carte services. Just remember, like everything external to your brain, tutors are a tool and only you can pass the bar and prevent forest fires.

juristudent wrote:F#$%. Now that reality is setting in and I have to start thinking about February...

For successful applicants, what are your thoughts on using a tutor? I relied almost exclusively on Barbri, crushed the completion percentage, and had almost no doubt I'd be on the pass list on my first attempt.

Is a tutor just a lazy way to get around being proactive about tailoring my study approach? Is there some legitimate value added? I can't go through this for a third time.

I got a tutor. He was a former bar grader because that was super important to me as my biggest weakness was with essays.

He was extremely tough, but he whipped me right into shape.

To me, the advantage of a tutor who was a former bar grader was that he didn't just know what I should put into an essay, he knew what I could and should leave OUT of an essay. Sometimes I would waste my time in an area that would only get me five points. If you have a five point issue, you need to put in five points worth of writing. If you have a 15 point issue, thats where you put in work.

He showed me how to get my essays done effectively and efficiently. No back and forth arguments, which is what I did throughout law school.

A lot of the time I hated him, because I was stressed out and he didn't sugar coat a damn thing. But I passed, so now I love him

FWIW -- I only know of three tutors who are past bar graders (2 in nor cal, and 1 in so cal). I think they fill up pretty quick. I used the one in so.cal and he was probably the best deal. His package was about 1/2 of the other tutor I spoke to (5000 vs. 2600), and he offered more services (3 essays a week +13 hours of tutoring vs. 2 essays a week + 6 hours of tutoring). The guy in nor cal was very sweet, and I think we would have gotten along like a house on fire, but in retrospect I'm glad I went with the tutor I went with.

Hi all. I was close enough to get a second read, but I definitely underestimated the PTs and essays. Kicking myself now.

Essay 1: 60
Essay 2: 57.5
Essay 3: 55
Essay 4: 60
Essay 5: 67.5
Essay 6: 65
PT A: 50
PT B: 57.5

Scaled written: 1359.6608
Scaled MBE: 1489.0
Scaled TOTAL: 1404.9295

I've got a lot of work to do, but I'm stumped on how to improve my PT score. I feel like nothing could've prepared me for PT A. Sigh.

rcharter1978 wrote:

juristudent wrote:F#$%. Now that reality is setting in and I have to start thinking about February...

For successful applicants, what are your thoughts on using a tutor? I relied almost exclusively on Barbri, crushed the completion percentage, and had almost no doubt I'd be on the pass list on my first attempt.

Is a tutor just a lazy way to get around being proactive about tailoring my study approach? Is there some legitimate value added? I can't go through this for a third time.

I got a tutor. He was a former bar grader because that was super important to me as my biggest weakness was with essays.

He was extremely tough, but he whipped me right into shape.

To me, the advantage of a tutor who was a former bar grader was that he didn't just know what I should put into an essay, he knew what I could and should leave OUT of an essay. Sometimes I would waste my time in an area that would only get me five points. If you have a five point issue, you need to put in five points worth of writing. If you have a 15 point issue, thats where you put in work.

He showed me how to get my essays done effectively and efficiently. No back and forth arguments, which is what I did throughout law school.

A lot of the time I hated him, because I was stressed out and he didn't sugar coat a damn thing. But I passed, so now I love him

FWIW -- I only know of three tutors who are past bar graders (2 in nor cal, and 1 in so cal). I think they fill up pretty quick. I used the one in so.cal and he was probably the best deal. His package was about 1/2 of the other tutor I spoke to (5000 vs. 2600), and he offered more services (3 essays a week +13 hours of tutoring vs. 2 essays a week + 6 hours of tutoring). The guy in nor cal was very sweet, and I think we would have gotten along like a house on fire, but in retrospect I'm glad I went with the tutor I went with.

Which tutor was this? I'm also looking for a tutor and signing up with one soon for around 5800. Also a former bar grader.

old_soul wrote:

rcharter1978 wrote:

juristudent wrote:F#$%. Now that reality is setting in and I have to start thinking about February...

For successful applicants, what are your thoughts on using a tutor? I relied almost exclusively on Barbri, crushed the completion percentage, and had almost no doubt I'd be on the pass list on my first attempt.

Is a tutor just a lazy way to get around being proactive about tailoring my study approach? Is there some legitimate value added? I can't go through this for a third time.

I got a tutor. He was a former bar grader because that was super important to me as my biggest weakness was with essays.

He was extremely tough, but he whipped me right into shape.

To me, the advantage of a tutor who was a former bar grader was that he didn't just know what I should put into an essay, he knew what I could and should leave OUT of an essay. Sometimes I would waste my time in an area that would only get me five points. If you have a five point issue, you need to put in five points worth of writing. If you have a 15 point issue, thats where you put in work.

He showed me how to get my essays done effectively and efficiently. No back and forth arguments, which is what I did throughout law school.

A lot of the time I hated him, because I was stressed out and he didn't sugar coat a damn thing. But I passed, so now I love him

FWIW -- I only know of three tutors who are past bar graders (2 in nor cal, and 1 in so cal). I think they fill up pretty quick. I used the one in so.cal and he was probably the best deal. His package was about 1/2 of the other tutor I spoke to (5000 vs. 2600), and he offered more services (3 essays a week +13 hours of tutoring vs. 2 essays a week + 6 hours of tutoring). The guy in nor cal was very sweet, and I think we would have gotten along like a house on fire, but in retrospect I'm glad I went with the tutor I went with.

Which tutor was this? I'm also looking for a tutor and signing up with one soon for around 5800. Also a former bar grader.

My tutor was Patrick Lin. I'm thinking you may be signing up with one of the nor cal tutors? Both seemed really cool. But 5800 is no joke!! Neither is 2600, but still.

First graders failed me, second graders passed me. Aggregated scores "operative" not enough to get over the 1440 hump, with a 1598 Scaled MBE. Does anyone know what the process is regarding "Request for Reconsideration?" Specifically, time-line, what is involved, how the decision is communicated. Also, has anyone heard of anyone being successful on such an appeal? Thanks.

cal_pushed wrote:First graders failed me, second graders passed me. Aggregated scores "operative" not enough to get over the 1440 hump, with a 1598 Scaled MBE. Does anyone know what the process is regarding "Request for Reconsideration?" Specifically, time-line, what is involved, how the decision is communicated. Also, has anyone heard of anyone being successful on such an appeal? Thanks.

It sucka that you were so close but I don't think they're going to reconsider your score. This is what they said on their information for unsuccessful applicants:

The Committee will not extend reconsideration based on challenges to its grading system or the judgments of its professional graders.

I am in Orange County. Does anyone know of a good essay tutor around here? Preferably one who is a past bar examine grader? Perhaps multiple ones so I can figure out the best deal. I will do my own online research, but always find TLS to be strong in the advice department.

Rcharter1978, you mentioned Patrick Lin?

I'm finishing up the lecture fill-in-the-blank notebook from barbri and I'm about to start Adaptibar soon after. I am was just going play with the Barbri early start program then do Barbri again all the while supplementing with Adaptibar. I know Barbri's essay portion is solid; however, I am now considering the tutor investment.

derfs wrote:

cal_pushed wrote:First graders failed me, second graders passed me. Aggregated scores "operative" not enough to get over the 1440 hump, with a 1598 Scaled MBE. Does anyone know what the process is regarding "Request for Reconsideration?" Specifically, time-line, what is involved, how the decision is communicated. Also, has anyone heard of anyone being successful on such an appeal? Thanks.

It sucka that you were so close but I don't think they're going to reconsider your score. This is what they said on their information for unsuccessful applicants:

The Committee will not extend reconsideration based on challenges to its grading system or the judgments of its professional graders.

Yeah, the website explains a very detailed system by which they grade, second grade, and reconsider said grades if need be. Once that process if over, you're SOL if you're under 1440.

rhs67858 wrote:I am in Orange County. Does anyone know of a good essay tutor around here? Preferably one who is a past bar examine grader? Perhaps multiple ones so I can figure out the best deal. I will do my own online research, but always find TLS to be strong in the advice department.

Rcharter1978, you mentioned Patrick Lin?

I'm finishing up the lecture fill-in-the-blank notebook from barbri and I'm about to start Adaptibar soon after. I am was just going play with the Barbri early start program then do Barbri again all the while supplementing with Adaptibar. I know Barbri's essay portion is solid; however, I am now considering the tutor investment.

Yeah, he was my tutor. He does Skype tutoring (because who the hell wants to drive from OC to the LA area?).

I don't know of any other former bar graders that tutor in the So. Cal area.

I've run into a lot of people who have said they are "bar trained," or something along those lines, but they haven't actually graded a bar exam for the CA bar.

But there may be other people, I just didn't do much research beyond the three I found because the former bar graders seem to fill up quickly. My first choice had been a guy in Nor Cal, but by the time I got back to him, and the other guy in Nor Cal they were booked solid.

rcharter1978 wrote:

rhs67858 wrote:I am in Orange County. Does anyone know of a good essay tutor around here? Preferably one who is a past bar examine grader? Perhaps multiple ones so I can figure out the best deal. I will do my own online research, but always find TLS to be strong in the advice department.

Rcharter1978, you mentioned Patrick Lin?

I'm finishing up the lecture fill-in-the-blank notebook from barbri and I'm about to start Adaptibar soon after. I am was just going play with the Barbri early start program then do Barbri again all the while supplementing with Adaptibar. I know Barbri's essay portion is solid; however, I am now considering the tutor investment.

Yeah, he was my tutor. He does Skype tutoring (because who the hell wants to drive from OC to the LA area?).

I don't know of any other former bar graders that tutor in the So. Cal area.

I've run into a lot of people who have said they are "bar trained," or something along those lines, but they haven't actually graded a bar exam for the CA bar.

But there may be other people, I just didn't do much research beyond the three I found because the former bar graders seem to fill up quickly. My first choice had been a guy in Nor Cal, but by the time I got back to him, and the other guy in Nor Cal they were booked solid.

Ok, do you still have his contact info? If so, PM me? I found him on this website I think: http://www.barexam101.com

rhs67858 wrote:

rcharter1978 wrote:

rhs67858 wrote:I am in Orange County. Does anyone know of a good essay tutor around here? Preferably one who is a past bar examine grader? Perhaps multiple ones so I can figure out the best deal. I will do my own online research, but always find TLS to be strong in the advice department.

Rcharter1978, you mentioned Patrick Lin?

I'm finishing up the lecture fill-in-the-blank notebook from barbri and I'm about to start Adaptibar soon after. I am was just going play with the Barbri early start program then do Barbri again all the while supplementing with Adaptibar. I know Barbri's essay portion is solid; however, I am now considering the tutor investment.

Yeah, he was my tutor. He does Skype tutoring (because who the hell wants to drive from OC to the LA area?).

I don't know of any other former bar graders that tutor in the So. Cal area.

I've run into a lot of people who have said they are "bar trained," or something along those lines, but they haven't actually graded a bar exam for the CA bar.

But there may be other people, I just didn't do much research beyond the three I found because the former bar graders seem to fill up quickly. My first choice had been a guy in Nor Cal, but by the time I got back to him, and the other guy in Nor Cal they were booked solid.

Ok, do you still have his contact info? If so, PM me? I found him on this website I think: http://www.barexam101.com

Thats the guy. I know he has a phone number on his site, it should work. If not I'm sure I have his number somewhere...maybe, hopefully

rcharter1978 wrote:

rhs67858 wrote:

rcharter1978 wrote:

rhs67858 wrote:I am in Orange County. Does anyone know of a good essay tutor around here? Preferably one who is a past bar examine grader? Perhaps multiple ones so I can figure out the best deal. I will do my own online research, but always find TLS to be strong in the advice department.

Rcharter1978, you mentioned Patrick Lin?

I'm finishing up the lecture fill-in-the-blank notebook from barbri and I'm about to start Adaptibar soon after. I am was just going play with the Barbri early start program then do Barbri again all the while supplementing with Adaptibar. I know Barbri's essay portion is solid; however, I am now considering the tutor investment.

Yeah, he was my tutor. He does Skype tutoring (because who the hell wants to drive from OC to the LA area?).

I don't know of any other former bar graders that tutor in the So. Cal area.

I've run into a lot of people who have said they are "bar trained," or something along those lines, but they haven't actually graded a bar exam for the CA bar.

But there may be other people, I just didn't do much research beyond the three I found because the former bar graders seem to fill up quickly. My first choice had been a guy in Nor Cal, but by the time I got back to him, and the other guy in Nor Cal they were booked solid.

Ok, do you still have his contact info? If so, PM me? I found him on this website I think: http://www.barexam101.com

Thats the guy. I know he has a phone number on his site, it should work. If not I'm sure I have his number somewhere...maybe, hopefully

Thanks bud

ArtistOfManliness wrote:

derfs wrote:

cal_pushed wrote:First graders failed me, second graders passed me. Aggregated scores "operative" not enough to get over the 1440 hump, with a 1598 Scaled MBE. Does anyone know what the process is regarding "Request for Reconsideration?" Specifically, time-line, what is involved, how the decision is communicated. Also, has anyone heard of anyone being successful on such an appeal? Thanks.

It sucka that you were so close but I don't think they're going to reconsider your score. This is what they said on their information for unsuccessful applicants:

The Committee will not extend reconsideration based on challenges to its grading system or the judgments of its professional graders.

Yeah, the website explains a very detailed system by which they grade, second grade, and reconsider said grades if need be. Once that process if over, you're SOL if you're under 1440.

I appreciate that. I actually have some extenuating circumstances that I think fall into clerical error. Wondering if anyone has information regarding the time line, or other individuals that have gone through the process.

Msnegativity wrote:Hi all. I was close enough to get a second read, but I definitely underestimated the PTs and essays. Kicking myself now.

Essay 1: 60
Essay 2: 57.5
Essay 3: 55
Essay 4: 60
Essay 5: 67.5
Essay 6: 65
PT A: 50
PT B: 57.5

Scaled written: 1359.6608
Scaled MBE: 1489.0
Scaled TOTAL: 1404.9295

I've got a lot of work to do, but I'm stumped on how to improve my PT score. I feel like nothing could've prepared me for PT A. Sigh.

That was unfortunate. I feel for you. On the other hand, you only need to do better on PT and one essay to pass this Feb. Re PT A, it was a classic assignment any associate would get first year in and I expect at least one PT will have something like it this Feb. You get the facts, the Black Letter, and the authorities that hint on how to apply the BL. The trick is to fast read everything, then start outlining with the BL as your big bullet point and the cases as your small one. The facts are the meat that will be regrouped under each point. Again, the trick is high concentration during 1st and 2nd reading of the facts. Make a mental or physical notes about a fact that is pertinent to either the BL or a case. The mapping out of the BL and authorities will help immensely in navigating through the facts. Practicing by reading long passages without breaking concentration. Doing this well enough and you will realize additional and more obscure facts/law that will distinguish your essay from the rest.