Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Discussions related to the bar exam are found in this forum
User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Sat Aug 08, 2015 7:50 pm

starryski wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:currently having post-bar exam depression. it sucks when everyone is so sure you passed. when i know i didn't. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


I truly wish people would quit it with that. I know people mean well, but I'm so tired of the "believe in yourself!", "I'm sure you did fine" and various other platitudes.

A friend texted me the other day and I told her that I didn't pass. And of course she launched into "you can't know," "believe in yourself," and on and on and on, and finally I just had to tell her that I didn't really need a pep talk, nor did I want one.

To me - this is the bottom line, and what I'm focused on. By the time November rolls around I will have been studying, you only have 2-3 months to avoid people until the February bar. And most of this is the holiday season where people are preoccupied with themselves, so they will be less interested in giving you lame affirmations. When you walk out of the February bar, or when I walk out of the February bar, I want to feel good. Feeling good means I can tell everyone, "hey, I didn't pass last time, but I'm pretty sure I passed this time."

I don't think many things matter AFTER you pass. It won't really be a huge deal that you didn't pass it the first time. Heck, Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar, and he became the president.

Anyways, just know that you aren't alone. I didn't leave my house for three days and I didn't talk to anyone.


Maybe if some of you guys/girls weren't such Debby Downers people wouldn't feel obligated to try and cheer you up with worthless positive comments.

Honestly, how do you expect people to respond when you tell them you failed?


Mostly, I expect them to listen and be supportive. Everyone who knows me, knows that I'm not one for useless positive platitudes. I'm not sure how someone is a Debby Downer when they are being honest, instead of lying to themselves. But then again, some people like to approach everything with false bravado. In law school they were the same people that would insist they crushed every exam, hit every issue, but by some sad twist of fate always ended up in the bottom of the class.


i dont tell people i think i failed. only my husband. my problem is people at work. everyone asked me how it went and i said i didnt feel good and all i have to do is wait. everyone has started calling me a lawyer, and esquire and i tell them no, not yet, but they say they're so sure i passed. i went to work right after the bar at a law firm...so i guess that was a big mistake lol. should have waited a while to go back i guess.


I don't see anything wrong with being honest with people, especially when they, as everyone will, ask you about it. Do you think its going to just eventually die down and you have to ride it out? If people will let it go in a week or two, maybe you can just ride it out. To me, if you didn't pass, you'll find out in November (in California). Then you only have three months until you take it again. And people will be embroiled in the holidays. You have thanksgiving, Christmas, and new years. That gets you up to January. Than you only have to make it one more month until you take it again. And if you crush it in February than you'll feel a million times better about people assuming you passed because you'll feel good about it too :)

texasbar

New
Posts: 63
Joined: Sun Aug 09, 2015 7:13 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby texasbar » Sun Aug 09, 2015 7:18 pm

What makes you guys think you failed? I walked out of the exam feeling the same way...

I felt that way because 1) I didn't finish the MPT (didn't discuss the second issue in any meaningful way and stopped mid-sentence when time was called); and 2) I thought I bombed the afternoon essays (I fully made up an answer on one of them).

I find it difficult to assess performance on the MBE. On practice exams I thought I did well on, I bombed and vice versa so I find it very difficult to know how the MBE went.

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Sun Aug 09, 2015 10:15 pm

texasbar wrote:What makes you guys think you failed? I walked out of the exam feeling the same way...

I felt that way because 1) I didn't finish the MPT (didn't discuss the second issue in any meaningful way and stopped mid-sentence when time was called); and 2) I thought I bombed the afternoon essays (I fully made up an answer on one of them).

I find it difficult to assess performance on the MBE. On practice exams I thought I did well on, I bombed and vice versa so I find it very difficult to know how the MBE went.


I'm in California (I don't know exactly how other bar exams are different) -- the performance test on day 1 was an absolute fail for me. To call it a shit show would be an insult to shit shows everywhere. I felt terrible about 3/6 essays and slightly less than terrible about the other 3/6. I ran out of time on the afternoon MBE's and just had to fill in B's for like the final 12 before time was called. And that's not even counting that I felt pretty bad about the MBE's that I did get to.

However, on the plus side Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar and went on to become president. Hilary Clinton failed and went on to become the Secretary of State and unofficial spokeswoman for pant suits. And ultimately I think the test is passable and I think I'll pass it next time.

User avatar
cram1

New
Posts: 14
Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2015 11:11 am

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby cram1 » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:51 am

941law wrote:Re: Barbri people who think they failed..

What's your plan?


Not Barbri, but my plan is:

1) review substantive topics, starting with my easiest subjects so that the more difficult subjects will be fresh in my mind when the exam rolls around.

2) Only 10 MBEs per day for now, and only Monday-Friday.

3) One essay per day, Monday-Friday

4) One performance test per month.

I have given myself Saturday and Sunday off, but I will use them as catch-up days to do any of the above that didn't get completed during the week.

starryski

Bronze
Posts: 232
Joined: Wed Jul 22, 2015 2:04 am

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby starryski » Mon Aug 10, 2015 9:42 am

i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

User avatar
941law

Bronze
Posts: 424
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2011 9:21 am

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby 941law » Mon Aug 10, 2015 12:28 pm

starryski wrote:i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

I'm just not sure this line of thinking is correct. We have people on here saying they did +3,000 and were still blindsided by the exam.

LAW813FL

Bronze
Posts: 164
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 7:25 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby LAW813FL » Mon Aug 10, 2015 12:34 pm

941law wrote:
starryski wrote:i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

I'm just not sure this line of thinking is correct. We have people on here saying they did +3,000 and were still blindsided by the exam.

Ya if I have to take this thing again, I'm going to be smarter with mbe prep. Hit more fringe issues instead of just doing a ton of questions. Gotta study smarter not harder

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Mon Aug 10, 2015 3:07 pm

LAW813FL wrote:
941law wrote:
starryski wrote:i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

I'm just not sure this line of thinking is correct. We have people on here saying they did +3,000 and were still blindsided by the exam.

Ya if I have to take this thing again, I'm going to be smarter with mbe prep. Hit more fringe issues instead of just doing a ton of questions. Gotta study smarter not harder


I've heard some people say that they learn the fringe issues better with the MBE questions because the MBE questions are more focused on the exceptions and smaller fringe areas. You don't agree with that, or do you think that you study the fringe issues better by studying them through outlines/essays/flash cards/something else?

LAW813FL

Bronze
Posts: 164
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 7:25 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby LAW813FL » Mon Aug 10, 2015 3:29 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:
LAW813FL wrote:
941law wrote:
starryski wrote:i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

I'm just not sure this line of thinking is correct. We have people on here saying they did +3,000 and were still blindsided by the exam.

Ya if I have to take this thing again, I'm going to be smarter with mbe prep. Hit more fringe issues instead of just doing a ton of questions. Gotta study smarter not harder


I've heard some people say that they learn the fringe issues better with the MBE questions because the MBE questions are more focused on the exceptions and smaller fringe areas. You don't agree with that, or do you think that you study the fringe issues better by studying them through outlines/essays/flash cards/something else?

I mean that Kaplan had a billion questions about the "big ticket items" that didn't really show up on the exam as much as I was told. So issues that I didn't spend as much time on are where I am going to beef up, instead of just doing a ton of questions.

dxchpwd

New
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 9:27 am

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby dxchpwd » Mon Aug 10, 2015 6:04 pm

Let's make something positive out of this thread. Here is my two cents:

-Don't tell anybody you are taking the bar exams. Especially those who you are afraid of telling if (God Forbid) you don't pass. The pressure is unnecessary and their petty does not contribute to any progress beside weakening you in the fashion of "They feel my pain. i will sleep and if I fail, they will understand"

-If you care about people's opinion, you must set that aside while studying. If you keep thinking about people before and after you meet them, don't meet anybody around the exam time.

-Focus every bit of your energy on studying. If you get tired or bored, repeat what your studied again and again. The more you repeat, the faster you will recall on the actual exam day. Make your goal scoring 150 on the MBE. Reach this goal as early as possible and then start reviewing the state specific subject and distinctions. Once you reach that goal maintain it. Take a daily set of practice tests in exam condition. Reviewing your right and wrong answer is time consuming. It's OK. This is pure knowledge. Let it take its time. Do 1.5 hours worth of MBE questions everyday. You must HAND WRITE annotations near your answers. Don't start by highlighting everything. Write first, and highlight in the revision. In short. I don't use a pen and highlighter in the same study session.

-Write your comments for the MBE in one color, and then later when you study distinctions, use another. This will be very hand on your final revision.
For example : MBE : Past consideration is invalid, unless... . Iin NY : Past consideration is valid if....

-Create your own Mnemonics.

That's all what I have on the top of my mind right now. Please feel free to share your advice to help others. I'm happy to discuss substantive law too, if we don't mention any bar exam questions.

Good luck everyone

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Mon Aug 10, 2015 6:44 pm

dxchpwd wrote:Let's make something positive out of this thread. Here is my two cents:

-Don't tell anybody you are taking the bar exams. Especially those who you are afraid of telling if (God Forbid) you don't pass. The pressure is unnecessary and their petty does not contribute to any progress beside weakening you in the fashion of "They feel my pain. i will sleep and if I fail, they will understand"

-If you care about people's opinion, you must set that aside while studying. If you keep thinking about people before and after you meet them, don't meet anybody around the exam time.

-Focus every bit of your energy on studying. If you get tired or bored, repeat what your studied again and again. The more you repeat, the faster you will recall on the actual exam day. Make your goal scoring 150 on the MBE. Reach this goal as early as possible and then start reviewing the state specific subject and distinctions. Once you reach that goal maintain it. Take a daily set of practice tests in exam condition. Reviewing your right and wrong answer is time consuming. It's OK. This is pure knowledge. Let it take its time. Do 1.5 hours worth of MBE questions everyday. You must HAND WRITE annotations near your answers. Don't start by highlighting everything. Write first, and highlight in the revision. In short. I don't use a pen and highlighter in the same study session.

-Write your comments for the MBE in one color, and then later when you study distinctions, use another. This will be very hand on your final revision.
For example : MBE : Past consideration is invalid, unless... . Iin NY : Past consideration is valid if....

-Create your own Mnemonics.

That's all what I have on the top of my mind right now. Please feel free to share your advice to help others. I'm happy to discuss substantive law too, if we don't mention any bar exam questions.

Good luck everyone


I think most of your advice is very sound. I started to create my own mnemonics when I realized that I really couldn't remember the one the Barbri guy gave for specific intent crimes (something about fake laughs), but I could remember BARFF SCALE for some reason.

However, even if you don't go around telling everyone you are taking the exam there are a lot of people that are going to know and are going to questions you about it, or bring it up. One poster works at a law firm and it sounds like she did that before the exam and is doing so after the exam. Of course the people in her law firm are going to know she took the exam. Generally, its the same with friends and close family, or even anyone that knows you graduated from law school. Your classmates, etc, etc. And in November, these are the same people that are either going to look up your results, or are going to ask you. As I read it, this is what some people are trying to work through, I don't think that's negative per se, I think thats just a frustrating reality.

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Mon Aug 10, 2015 6:49 pm

LAW813FL wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
LAW813FL wrote:
941law wrote:
starryski wrote:i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

I'm just not sure this line of thinking is correct. We have people on here saying they did +3,000 and were still blindsided by the exam.

Ya if I have to take this thing again, I'm going to be smarter with mbe prep. Hit more fringe issues instead of just doing a ton of questions. Gotta study smarter not harder


I've heard some people say that they learn the fringe issues better with the MBE questions because the MBE questions are more focused on the exceptions and smaller fringe areas. You don't agree with that, or do you think that you study the fringe issues better by studying them through outlines/essays/flash cards/something else?

I mean that Kaplan had a billion questions about the "big ticket items" that didn't really show up on the exam as much as I was told. So issues that I didn't spend as much time on are where I am going to beef up, instead of just doing a ton of questions.


Interesting, I was thinking about trying to get the Kaplan QBank, but if its not that helpful I may hold back. Did you only do Kaplan? I'm also interested in Adaptibar, so I'm wondering if people thought that helped with the MBE's.

LAW813FL

Bronze
Posts: 164
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 7:25 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby LAW813FL » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:04 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:
LAW813FL wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
LAW813FL wrote:
941law wrote:
starryski wrote:i will definitely try to work on more MBEs this time around. I did around 1400, but i feel like i should have done double that.

I'm just not sure this line of thinking is correct. We have people on here saying they did +3,000 and were still blindsided by the exam.

Ya if I have to take this thing again, I'm going to be smarter with mbe prep. Hit more fringe issues instead of just doing a ton of questions. Gotta study smarter not harder


I've heard some people say that they learn the fringe issues better with the MBE questions because the MBE questions are more focused on the exceptions and smaller fringe areas. You don't agree with that, or do you think that you study the fringe issues better by studying them through outlines/essays/flash cards/something else?

I mean that Kaplan had a billion questions about the "big ticket items" that didn't really show up on the exam as much as I was told. So issues that I didn't spend as much time on are where I am going to beef up, instead of just doing a ton of questions.


Interesting, I was thinking about trying to get the Kaplan QBank, but if its not that helpful I may hold back. Did you only do Kaplan? I'm also interested in Adaptibar, so I'm wondering if people thought that helped with the MBE's.

I did Kaplan and adaptibar. I did around 1800 Kaplan questions and 700 adaptibar. They were both definitely helpful but again i just felt like the mbe didn't test big ticket items as much as I had thought.

Like the Kaplan midterm and final both had larceny questions. I don't think the mbe had any and even the mbes crimes questions were so hard. Idk I can't think about that right now

waxecstatic

Bronze
Posts: 327
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:07 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby waxecstatic » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:31 pm

You're just obsessed. There's no doubt about it or else you wouldn't have created this thread less than two weeks after the bar.

Most of the questions on the bar were like this: What is the northernmost point in the world? And your answers were all correct depending on how you measured northernmost point. In other words, it wasn't about simply knowing the black letter law but rather getting in the bar examiners heads to figure out what they were actually intending to ask. There were hardly any questions where a person did something and you had to say what the tort or what the crime was. They were all about defining a certain perspective and looking for the answer the bar examiners wanted it to be. There were plenty questions where I knew what was going on but couldn't pick an answer that fit the actual definition.

If you think doing more studying is the answer, I question that. Maybe for the essays---certainly not for the MBE, at least to a point. Try and have a positive attitude and hope for the best.

LAW813FL

Bronze
Posts: 164
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 7:25 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby LAW813FL » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:35 pm

waxecstatic wrote:You're just obsessed. There's no doubt about it or else you wouldn't have created this thread less than two weeks after the bar.

Most of the questions on the bar were like this: What is the northernmost point in the world? And your answers were all correct depending on how you measured northernmost point. In other words, it wasn't about simply knowing the black letter law but rather getting in the bar examiners heads to figure out what they were actually intending to ask. There were hardly any questions where a person did something and you had to say what the tort or what the crime was. They were all about defining a certain perspective and looking for the answer the bar examiners wanted it to be. There were plenty questions where I knew what was going on but couldn't pick an answer that fit the actual definition.

If you think doing more studying is the answer, I question that. Maybe for the essays---certainly not for the MBE, at least to a point. Try and have a positive attitude and hope for the best.

Who created this thread? Also, lulz

waxecstatic

Bronze
Posts: 327
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:07 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby waxecstatic » Mon Aug 10, 2015 7:45 pm

I know how all you guys feel tho. I took the bar in February because I was totally unprepared for the July 2014 bar. I studied hard, I knew the blackletter law, but I got completely fucked on the MBE. Even if I scored in the 30th percentile on the MBE, I probably would have passed. On one essay I got a perfect score. I failed by about 10 points and I was really disappointed in myself. It was totally my fault for not doing enough MBE questions and figuring out the mechanics of the questions. I thought to myself I got a perfect score on an essay and yet I failed, something is definitely not right here.

I studied extremely hard for this July bar exam. I had the BarBri Conviser Mini Review on my computer in PDF form and I looked at it like it was a script to a play and I had to memorize every line. And you know what, I almost did. I did Adaptibar on top of that and had the state outlines from BarBri as well. I did about 90% of the Adaptibar questions and felt way more prepared for the MBE than I did in February. I felt almost like a different person altogether.

As we know, the MBE was extremely difficult for July. The questions were on every area that people will not answer correctly no matter how much they study like RAP and mortgages and severing claims in civ pro, or knowing when res judicata applies and collateral estoppel doesn't, whether an executive action can override a legislative action etc etc. (BTW, when is a lawyer ever going to have a client call him and ask about a decision by the President? As if that small-town lawyer can do anything about it anyway).

My point is, I know I'm rambling, I feel like shit too sometimes, and it's completely ruined my life. I don't talk to people from law school, and I try to avoid any conversation with relatives about my life. I basically am completely handicapped socially and work-wise. I don't know what to look for as far a job goes, and I feel like having failed the bar has basically scarred my resume and my life.

But I try to think that I gave it my all this time. But I don't know--all I can do is keep a positive attitude.

spacecaps

New
Posts: 33
Joined: Wed Mar 07, 2012 6:11 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby spacecaps » Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:08 pm

wow. honestly, i think chilling out would be your best course of action right now. you likely studied WAY more than enough. however, it's one thing to memorize the entire CMR (completely unnecessary imo), but it's another thing to actually absorb and understand what you memorized. it's also about recognizing how YOU learn best. i think studying for the bar is a very individualized thing and there's no exact formula for doing it correctly.

dxchpwd

New
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2014 9:27 am

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby dxchpwd » Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:39 pm

waxecstatic wrote:I know how all you guys feel tho. I took the bar in February because I was totally unprepared for the July 2014 bar. I studied hard, I knew the blackletter law, but I got completely fucked on the MBE. Even if I scored in the 30th percentile on the MBE, I probably would have passed. On one essay I got a perfect score. I failed by about 10 points and I was really disappointed in myself. It was totally my fault for not doing enough MBE questions and figuring out the mechanics of the questions. I thought to myself I got a perfect score on an essay and yet I failed, something is definitely not right here.

I studied extremely hard for this July bar exam. I had the BarBri Conviser Mini Review on my computer in PDF form and I looked at it like it was a script to a play and I had to memorize every line. And you know what, I almost did. I did Adaptibar on top of that and had the state outlines from BarBri as well. I did about 90% of the Adaptibar questions and felt way more prepared for the MBE than I did in February. I felt almost like a different person altogether.

As we know, the MBE was extremely difficult for July. The questions were on every area that people will not answer correctly no matter how much they study like RAP and mortgages and severing claims in civ pro, or knowing when res judicata applies and collateral estoppel doesn't, whether an executive action can override a legislative action etc etc. (BTW, when is a lawyer ever going to have a client call him and ask about a decision by the President? As if that small-town lawyer can do anything about it anyway).

My point is, I know I'm rambling, I feel like shit too sometimes, and it's completely ruined my life. I don't talk to people from law school, and I try to avoid any conversation with relatives about my life. I basically am completely handicapped socially and work-wise. I don't know what to look for as far a job goes, and I feel like having failed the bar has basically scarred my resume and my life.

But I try to think that I gave it my all this time. But I don't know--all I can do is keep a positive attitude.


My friend, this positive attitude is most of what you need to pass. And I am sure you will pass with flying colors. You did what it takes and sure you got better with each attempt and with any amount of knowledge you gained every time, you are bypassing a contribution of the quality of what a lawyer you will be. This is twisted, but although the bar doesn't define the
Quality of the career you will have, it's a must.

Think of it as a neck of a bottle. I'm confident that at least each time your score increased. You are getting closer. And this time, who knows. I'm here for a reason and a cause. This is called determination and predictable rather than obsession.

If it makes you feel better, English is not my first language. Whee I went to law school has a totally different law system.

I agree which the poster that says more studying can be harmful. But you must have a fixed pool of questions that covers everything and make sure you are familiar with the scenario to avoid the contagious feeling of "I'm screwed" on the exam day. It carries over to the next question.

Perceiving knowledge now, away from the stress of the exam period is surprisingly awesome. Especially for foreign graduates who are not just wing tested on their 1l subjects.

I believe everyone is here to help or to get help. Those posters who keep saying "chill out"and "you are obsessed". May I ask, how did you come across this thread?

A) You are obsessed too.
B) You are unable to chill out.
C) You are a citizen from state ass.
D) All of the above.

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Mon Aug 10, 2015 8:44 pm

waxecstatic wrote:I know how all you guys feel tho. I took the bar in February because I was totally unprepared for the July 2014 bar. I studied hard, I knew the blackletter law, but I got completely fucked on the MBE. Even if I scored in the 30th percentile on the MBE, I probably would have passed. On one essay I got a perfect score. I failed by about 10 points and I was really disappointed in myself. It was totally my fault for not doing enough MBE questions and figuring out the mechanics of the questions. I thought to myself I got a perfect score on an essay and yet I failed, something is definitely not right here.

I studied extremely hard for this July bar exam. I had the BarBri Conviser Mini Review on my computer in PDF form and I looked at it like it was a script to a play and I had to memorize every line. And you know what, I almost did. I did Adaptibar on top of that and had the state outlines from BarBri as well. I did about 90% of the Adaptibar questions and felt way more prepared for the MBE than I did in February. I felt almost like a different person altogether.

As we know, the MBE was extremely difficult for July. The questions were on every area that people will not answer correctly no matter how much they study like RAP and mortgages and severing claims in civ pro, or knowing when res judicata applies and collateral estoppel doesn't, whether an executive action can override a legislative action etc etc. (BTW, when is a lawyer ever going to have a client call him and ask about a decision by the President? As if that small-town lawyer can do anything about it anyway).

My point is, I know I'm rambling, I feel like shit too sometimes, and it's completely ruined my life. I don't talk to people from law school, and I try to avoid any conversation with relatives about my life. I basically am completely handicapped socially and work-wise. I don't know what to look for as far a job goes, and I feel like having failed the bar has basically scarred my resume and my life.

But I try to think that I gave it my all this time. But I don't know--all I can do is keep a positive attitude.


I think that venting is part of what this board, and part of what this thread is/should be about. As I've said before, failing the bar didn't ruin Franklin Roosevelt's life, it didn't ruin Hilary Clinton's life, it didn't ruin Michelle Obama's life. And apparently going to law school and STILL not passing the bar has not ruined Antonio Villarigoso's life (spelling, I know).

I'm fairly certain I'll avoid people a lot of people from November - February/June. Thank goodness for the holiday season. However, it sounds like you put in the work and you probably did pretty good this time around. I hope when I walk in the exam in February, I feel the way you must have felt walking into this exam.

I know I didn't do enough MBE questions, period. But the way Barbri was set up, they gave so much homework that it seemed pretty impossible (and yes, before someone mentions how they amazingly did all the homework and another 20,000 MBE questions on top of that -- I get it, and my hats off to you, you're amazing). And it took me a while to figure out what would work best for me, so I think I know better how to study instead of having to face a learning curve. Interestingly enough, at my school they were pretty strongly suggesting that you not review the CMR, and when I finally asked someone else about it, they told me that should be my bible :(

User avatar
941law

Bronze
Posts: 424
Joined: Wed Aug 24, 2011 9:21 am

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby 941law » Mon Aug 10, 2015 10:43 pm

If the CMR (or any mini outline) is all you did then you probably missed a lot of questions. Not to insinuate anyone did that.

Thinking on your feet, knowing the BLL, understanding the goal of the question, of the facts, of the answers was the point.

We all failed.

waxecstatic

Bronze
Posts: 327
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:07 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby waxecstatic » Mon Aug 10, 2015 11:14 pm

941law wrote:If the CMR (or any mini outline) is all you did then you probably missed a lot of questions. Not to insinuate anyone did that.

Thinking on your feet, knowing the BLL, understanding the goal of the question, of the facts, of the answers was the point.

We all failed.



Well, the big book I was told, was just for reference. It was the same thing as the CMR, word for word, but would discuss cases and go into more detail in certain complex areas. I would use it occasionally but it was just so overwhelming and if I tried using it I would probably only make it through 3 or 4 subjects.

There's absolutely no point in arguing about what the goal of each question should be.

User avatar
robinhoodOO

Silver
Posts: 874
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:08 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby robinhoodOO » Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:34 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:currently having post-bar exam depression. it sucks when everyone is so sure you passed. when i know i didn't. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


I truly wish people would quit it with that. I know people mean well, but I'm so tired of the "believe in yourself!", "I'm sure you did fine" and various other platitudes.

A friend texted me the other day and I told her that I didn't pass. And of course she launched into "you can't know," "believe in yourself," and on and on and on, and finally I just had to tell her that I didn't really need a pep talk, nor did I want one.

To me - this is the bottom line, and what I'm focused on. By the time November rolls around I will have been studying, you only have 2-3 months to avoid people until the February bar. And most of this is the holiday season where people are preoccupied with themselves, so they will be less interested in giving you lame affirmations. When you walk out of the February bar, or when I walk out of the February bar, I want to feel good. Feeling good means I can tell everyone, "hey, I didn't pass last time, but I'm pretty sure I passed this time."

I don't think many things matter AFTER you pass. It won't really be a huge deal that you didn't pass it the first time. Heck, Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar, and he became the president.

Anyways, just know that you aren't alone. I didn't leave my house for three days and I didn't talk to anyone.


Maybe if some of you guys/girls weren't such Debby Downers people wouldn't feel obligated to try and cheer you up with worthless positive comments.

Honestly, how do you expect people to respond when you tell them you failed?


Mostly, I expect them to listen and be supportive. Everyone who knows me, knows that I'm not one for useless positive platitudes. I'm not sure how someone is a Debby Downer when they are being honest, instead of lying to themselves. But then again, some people like to approach everything with false bravado. In law school they were the same people that would insist they crushed every exam, hit every issue, but by some sad twist of fate always ended up in the bottom of the class.


Then you live in an alternative reality that doesn't comport to your own experiences (where people encourage you with those same "useless positive platitudes" that you're getting)--hehe. Again, seems foolish to bemoan those attempting to be positive and promote, in general, good feelings. They are, in their way, listening and being supportive ;)

And, no one said to lie to yourself, but if you don't want someone to tell you things you should expect to hear when communicating a particular message, tell them something slightly more positive. That doesn't mean you're lying to yourself, though. Internalize it however you'd like, really.
Last edited by robinhoodOO on Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
robinhoodOO

Silver
Posts: 874
Joined: Wed Mar 16, 2011 1:08 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby robinhoodOO » Wed Aug 12, 2015 4:37 pm

rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:currently having post-bar exam depression. it sucks when everyone is so sure you passed. when i know i didn't. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


I truly wish people would quit it with that. I know people mean well, but I'm so tired of the "believe in yourself!", "I'm sure you did fine" and various other platitudes.

A friend texted me the other day and I told her that I didn't pass. And of course she launched into "you can't know," "believe in yourself," and on and on and on, and finally I just had to tell her that I didn't really need a pep talk, nor did I want one.

To me - this is the bottom line, and what I'm focused on. By the time November rolls around I will have been studying, you only have 2-3 months to avoid people until the February bar. And most of this is the holiday season where people are preoccupied with themselves, so they will be less interested in giving you lame affirmations. When you walk out of the February bar, or when I walk out of the February bar, I want to feel good. Feeling good means I can tell everyone, "hey, I didn't pass last time, but I'm pretty sure I passed this time."

I don't think many things matter AFTER you pass. It won't really be a huge deal that you didn't pass it the first time. Heck, Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar, and he became the president.

Anyways, just know that you aren't alone. I didn't leave my house for three days and I didn't talk to anyone.


Maybe if some of you guys/girls weren't such Debby Downers people wouldn't feel obligated to try and cheer you up with worthless positive comments.

Honestly, how do you expect people to respond when you tell them you failed?


Mostly, I expect them to listen and be supportive. Everyone who knows me, knows that I'm not one for useless positive platitudes. I'm not sure how someone is a Debby Downer when they are being honest, instead of lying to themselves. But then again, some people like to approach everything with false bravado. In law school they were the same people that would insist they crushed every exam, hit every issue, but by some sad twist of fate always ended up in the bottom of the class.


i dont tell people i think i failed. only my husband. my problem is people at work. everyone asked me how it went and i said i didnt feel good and all i have to do is wait. everyone has started calling me a lawyer, and esquire and i tell them no, not yet, but they say they're so sure i passed. i went to work right after the bar at a law firm...so i guess that was a big mistake lol. should have waited a while to go back i guess.


I don't see anything wrong with being honest with people, especially when they, as everyone will, ask you about it. Do you think its going to just eventually die down and you have to ride it out? If people will let it go in a week or two, maybe you can just ride it out. To me, if you didn't pass, you'll find out in November (in California). Then you only have three months until you take it again. And people will be embroiled in the holidays. You have thanksgiving, Christmas, and new years. That gets you up to January. Than you only have to make it one more month until you take it again. And if you crush it in February than you'll feel a million times better about people assuming you passed because you'll feel good about it too :)


Again, I think the point is: If you don't want those "useless positive platitudes," don't say the things that almost assuredly result in them being provided. I personally don't feel like I failed or passed, but I'd be surprised if I failed given how much I studied and my past history. So, I simply tell people it was a difficult exam, but I feel confident (which I do try to do) and we'll see come November. This drops the subject every time without rehashing everything and isn't a lie :)

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Wed Aug 12, 2015 5:59 pm

robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:currently having post-bar exam depression. it sucks when everyone is so sure you passed. when i know i didn't. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


I truly wish people would quit it with that. I know people mean well, but I'm so tired of the "believe in yourself!", "I'm sure you did fine" and various other platitudes.

A friend texted me the other day and I told her that I didn't pass. And of course she launched into "you can't know," "believe in yourself," and on and on and on, and finally I just had to tell her that I didn't really need a pep talk, nor did I want one.

To me - this is the bottom line, and what I'm focused on. By the time November rolls around I will have been studying, you only have 2-3 months to avoid people until the February bar. And most of this is the holiday season where people are preoccupied with themselves, so they will be less interested in giving you lame affirmations. When you walk out of the February bar, or when I walk out of the February bar, I want to feel good. Feeling good means I can tell everyone, "hey, I didn't pass last time, but I'm pretty sure I passed this time."

I don't think many things matter AFTER you pass. It won't really be a huge deal that you didn't pass it the first time. Heck, Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar, and he became the president.

Anyways, just know that you aren't alone. I didn't leave my house for three days and I didn't talk to anyone.


Maybe if some of you guys/girls weren't such Debby Downers people wouldn't feel obligated to try and cheer you up with worthless positive comments.

Honestly, how do you expect people to respond when you tell them you failed?


Mostly, I expect them to listen and be supportive. Everyone who knows me, knows that I'm not one for useless positive platitudes. I'm not sure how someone is a Debby Downer when they are being honest, instead of lying to themselves. But then again, some people like to approach everything with false bravado. In law school they were the same people that would insist they crushed every exam, hit every issue, but by some sad twist of fate always ended up in the bottom of the class.


Then you live in an alternative reality that doesn't comport to your own experiences (where people encourage you with those same "useless positive platitudes" that you're getting)--hehe. Again, seems foolish to bemoan those attempting to be positive and promote, in general, good feelings. They are, in their way, listening and being supportive ;)

And, no one said to lie to yourself, but if you don't want someone to tell you things you should expect to hear when communicating a particular message, tell them something slightly more positive. That doesn't mean you're lying to yourself, though. Internalize it however you'd like, really.


An alternate reality where people are supportive and listen? I don't see how expecting one thing and getting another puts me in an alternate reality. It very much puts me in an actual reality where I expect one thing and get another. That is not an alternate reality, in actual reality you often expect one thing and get another. Undertaking to give people false hope is ridiculous and unhelpful. Its superficially helpful, but underneath the surface the only thing you're doing is giving someone a false hope, which will only make the sting of the painful reality worse. But some people can't, or don't think beyond the superficial.

I'm not going to lie to people, because I'm not going to have a hard conversation twice, I'm only going to have it once. I'm not going to put people in a position to excitedly text and call me in November because I've BS'ed them into thinking I've passed. Thats not a fun position for myself or for the other party.

But hey, lying and falsity and BS and false bravado are certainly methods that people in law school have used over the years so perhaps it is what works for them.

User avatar
rcharter1978

Gold
Posts: 4275
Joined: Thu Aug 06, 2015 12:49 pm

Re: Feb 2016 Bar Exam discussion

Postby rcharter1978 » Wed Aug 12, 2015 6:03 pm

robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
robinhoodOO wrote:
rcharter1978 wrote:
starryski wrote:currently having post-bar exam depression. it sucks when everyone is so sure you passed. when i know i didn't. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


I truly wish people would quit it with that. I know people mean well, but I'm so tired of the "believe in yourself!", "I'm sure you did fine" and various other platitudes.

A friend texted me the other day and I told her that I didn't pass. And of course she launched into "you can't know," "believe in yourself," and on and on and on, and finally I just had to tell her that I didn't really need a pep talk, nor did I want one.

To me - this is the bottom line, and what I'm focused on. By the time November rolls around I will have been studying, you only have 2-3 months to avoid people until the February bar. And most of this is the holiday season where people are preoccupied with themselves, so they will be less interested in giving you lame affirmations. When you walk out of the February bar, or when I walk out of the February bar, I want to feel good. Feeling good means I can tell everyone, "hey, I didn't pass last time, but I'm pretty sure I passed this time."

I don't think many things matter AFTER you pass. It won't really be a huge deal that you didn't pass it the first time. Heck, Franklin Roosevelt failed the bar, and he became the president.

Anyways, just know that you aren't alone. I didn't leave my house for three days and I didn't talk to anyone.


Maybe if some of you guys/girls weren't such Debby Downers people wouldn't feel obligated to try and cheer you up with worthless positive comments.

Honestly, how do you expect people to respond when you tell them you failed?


Mostly, I expect them to listen and be supportive. Everyone who knows me, knows that I'm not one for useless positive platitudes. I'm not sure how someone is a Debby Downer when they are being honest, instead of lying to themselves. But then again, some people like to approach everything with false bravado. In law school they were the same people that would insist they crushed every exam, hit every issue, but by some sad twist of fate always ended up in the bottom of the class.


i dont tell people i think i failed. only my husband. my problem is people at work. everyone asked me how it went and i said i didnt feel good and all i have to do is wait. everyone has started calling me a lawyer, and esquire and i tell them no, not yet, but they say they're so sure i passed. i went to work right after the bar at a law firm...so i guess that was a big mistake lol. should have waited a while to go back i guess.


I don't see anything wrong with being honest with people, especially when they, as everyone will, ask you about it. Do you think its going to just eventually die down and you have to ride it out? If people will let it go in a week or two, maybe you can just ride it out. To me, if you didn't pass, you'll find out in November (in California). Then you only have three months until you take it again. And people will be embroiled in the holidays. You have thanksgiving, Christmas, and new years. That gets you up to January. Than you only have to make it one more month until you take it again. And if you crush it in February than you'll feel a million times better about people assuming you passed because you'll feel good about it too :)


Again, I think the point is: If you don't want those "useless positive platitudes," don't say the things that almost assuredly result in them being provided. I personally don't feel like I failed or passed, but I'd be surprised if I failed given how much I studied and my past history. So, I simply tell people it was a difficult exam, but I feel confident (which I do try to do) and we'll see come November. This drops the subject every time without rehashing everything and isn't a lie :)


Again, I'm not going to lie to people or BS people. I'm also not going to run away when they ask me a question. You tell them you feel confident, I do not, because I don't, and because I'm not a liar.

But here is a question you might be able to answer for me -- does the TLS forum have a way for me to block certain users? I don't have much time for annoying blowhards.....and if I encounter any in the future it would be good to know how to simply block them. Thanks in advance. :)



Return to “Bar Exam Prep and Discussion Forum�

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: barprepforca, Bulldog99, Google [Bot], smile0751, Transfer2016, White Dwarf and 74 guests