[Please delete this thread]

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pikachoo
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[Please delete this thread]

Postby pikachoo » Mon Aug 28, 2017 7:39 pm

Moderator please delete this thread.

I don't feel comfortable with the aggressive outing of my private information by UVA2B.

Please delete this thread
Last edited by pikachoo on Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Dcc617
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Re: How are US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby Dcc617 » Mon Aug 28, 2017 7:42 pm

I just finished OCI at my T14. The military experience definitely helped. It was a good thing to talk about during interviews and I was able to pull a lot of good interview stories from it.

pikachoo
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Re: How are US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby pikachoo » Mon Aug 28, 2017 7:51 pm

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Last edited by pikachoo on Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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malleus discentium
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby malleus discentium » Mon Aug 28, 2017 8:09 pm

pikachoo wrote:Does anyone know if US military veterans receive any boost when it comes to hiring/clerkships?

I am considering joining the US Army and I will be WAY older (30s) than most 0Ls. In addition to the financail aid help from the GI bill, I was wondering if top firms/clerkships would give any boost to T14 graduates wih military experience.

Thank you in advance!

Are you deciding whether to join the army based on how it will affect your legal hiring prospects??

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Dcc617
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby Dcc617 » Mon Aug 28, 2017 8:15 pm

malleus discentium wrote:
pikachoo wrote:Does anyone know if US military veterans receive any boost when it comes to hiring/clerkships?

I am considering joining the US Army and I will be WAY older (30s) than most 0Ls. In addition to the financail aid help from the GI bill, I was wondering if top firms/clerkships would give any boost to T14 graduates wih military experience.

Thank you in advance!

Are you deciding whether to join the army based on how it will affect your legal hiring prospects??


Oh god, I assumed this was a person thinking of leaving the military. OP, please don't join the military for a law school bump.

pikachoo
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby pikachoo » Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:55 pm

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Last edited by pikachoo on Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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UVA2B
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby UVA2B » Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:09 pm

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Last edited by UVA2B on Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

pikachoo
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby pikachoo » Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:25 pm

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Last edited by pikachoo on Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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UVA2B
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby UVA2B » Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:34 pm

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Last edited by UVA2B on Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

pikachoo
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby pikachoo » Mon Aug 28, 2017 10:49 pm

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Last edited by pikachoo on Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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UVA2B
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby UVA2B » Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:00 pm

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Last edited by UVA2B on Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

AJordan
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby AJordan » Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:48 am

Just a bit of perspective on the military that a lot of people don't talk about but is worth mentioning: almost everyone who is in the military, at some point, hates it and dreams of getting out. It catches us when we least expect it. Once you dislike being in the military your life gets pretty rough.

You're working, at minimum, a fifty hour week for very low wages in the best of situations. Double that at the worst. As an analogy, people complain about biglaw for a variety of reasons on this board: work/life balance, tedious work, lack of realistic exit options, substance abuse, culture, fear... I'm not even a 1L but I've been in the military since 2003 and I can definitely vouch for the fact that these are ALL problems in the military. Now imagine doing that in Afghanistan while being shot at by people with whom you have no real issue otherwise. If you WANT to be there to help your buddies, and that's almost the only real reason anybody enjoys deployment unless they're a psychopath, then it's incredibly rewarding. If you're already in the situation where you're counting the days until you leave it is a slippery slope toward anxiety, depression, substance abuse, and possibly worse. I've seen three of my good friends commit suicide during their first enlistment.

All of that said, if you do decide to take this route, I recommend you do it as enlisted. You'll make less money, you can still do a basically free masters degree in four years while getting paid, but you'll have far less responsibility than if you're an officer - thus, less chance of you getting someone killed. You learn how to take orders and work inside a culture where you're essentially worth about as much as the guy in the office who cleans the toilets. It builds perspective. You'll also learn to work with a group of people that you probably don't have a lot of experience working with no matter where it is you're from. My team has a Puerto Rican team leader, an HBCU alum as a boss, two rednecks, and a blowhard granola from Colorado. There is value in that.

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MichiganHoosier
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby MichiganHoosier » Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:12 am

If you decide to follow the advice AJordan and go the enlisted route, go Air Force. Your life will not be nearly as miserable.

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MichiganHoosier
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby MichiganHoosier » Tue Aug 29, 2017 2:20 am

UVA2B wrote:
pikachoo wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
pikachoo wrote:
Dcc617 wrote:
malleus discentium wrote:
pikachoo wrote:Does anyone know if US military veterans receive any boost when it comes to hiring/clerkships?

I am considering joining the US Army and I will be WAY older (30s) than most 0Ls. In addition to the financail aid help from the GI bill, I was wondering if top firms/clerkships would give any boost to T14 graduates wih military experience.

Thank you in advance!

Are you deciding whether to join the army based on how it will affect your legal hiring prospects??


Oh god, I assumed this was a person thinking of leaving the military. OP, please don't join the military for a law school bump.


I've already been accepted to law school.

I was curious about the employment prospects with military experience under your belt.


But do you have military experience now that you've been accepted to law school, or are you thinking of joining in hopes of improving your outcomes out of law school? If the former, it gives a boost. If the latter, you're doing this wrong.


Latter. I've deferred for a year and am now seriously considering joining the army for a variety of reasons (to develop courage, social skills, team-work etc) and employment prospects of course rank high.

So.. are you saying military experience won't give much of a boost when it comes to OCI, clerkship hiring, etc?


No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying you shouldn't join the Army for any of the reasons you've given, because they are generally bad reasons to join. And when you suggest employment prospects rank high, I'm doubly concerned about you joining.

I'm going to take a strong stance: don't join the military if you don't want to serve the country at no benefit to you. Even though there are incredible benefits in serving the country, if you join the Army (or any of the services, fwiw) with a sole intention of improving your job prospects or other pretty much meaningless intangibles, you will be disappointed. You're not going to magically find courage, social skills, or teamwork simply because you joined the military. And those deficiencies won't be masked simply because you joined the Army.

Look, joining the military is a serious commitment. It could be a four year commitment, followed by Harvard and a successful private career. But you shouldn't enter the profession thinking that. It's not a resume line. If you think it is, you're doing a disservice to anyone who serves with you.


LOL if you think everyone who joins the military does it for selfless reasons and patriotism. I'd go as far as to say that 65% of SMs (service members) are serving for personal benefit and future employment prospects/just a job that pays the bills. It's disturbing with how many people suddenly become un-deployable when a deployment is announced. I agree with you UVA2b that he shouldn't join for the reasons stated, but lets be real, he will not be an anomaly by any means.

AJordan
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby AJordan » Tue Aug 29, 2017 4:33 am

MichiganHoosier wrote:
LOL if you think everyone who joins the military does it for selfless reasons and patriotism. I'd go as far as to say that 65% of SMs (service members) are serving for personal benefit and future employment prospects/just a job that pays the bills. It's disturbing with how many people suddenly become un-deployable when a deployment is announced. I agree with you UVA2b that he shouldn't join for the reasons stated, but lets be real, he will not be an anomaly by any means.


Certainly true. I think I agree with UVA though that people who join for that reason are typically pretty miserable and tough to work with eventually. Enlisted folks are a lot easier to deal with if they're looking to do 4 and get out. They essentially do details for a few years, make E5, and then get out. Fine. Officers with that mindset have a lot more power to make a culture miserable. I guess maybe I'm being too defensive of the military and giving too much of a fuck when it ain't my turn to do so. I just feel pretty strongly about this. Icebergs as we say.

And I agree with you that the Air Force is almost always the best option unless you want to be on a boat

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MichiganHoosier
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby MichiganHoosier » Tue Aug 29, 2017 12:05 pm

AJordan wrote:
MichiganHoosier wrote:
LOL if you think everyone who joins the military does it for selfless reasons and patriotism. I'd go as far as to say that 65% of SMs (service members) are serving for personal benefit and future employment prospects/just a job that pays the bills. It's disturbing with how many people suddenly become un-deployable when a deployment is announced. I agree with you UVA2b that he shouldn't join for the reasons stated, but lets be real, he will not be an anomaly by any means.


Certainly true. I think I agree with UVA though that people who join for that reason are typically pretty miserable and tough to work with eventually. Enlisted folks are a lot easier to deal with if they're looking to do 4 and get out. They essentially do details for a few years, make E5, and then get out. Fine. Officers with that mindset have a lot more power to make a culture miserable. I guess maybe I'm being too defensive of the military and giving too much of a fuck when it ain't my turn to do so. I just feel pretty strongly about this. Icebergs as we say.

And I agree with you that the Air Force is almost always the best option unless you want to be on a boat


It's good to care. Especially if you're an officer. Our Officer Corps has a tendency to lack empathy in some departments. Enlisted are easier to deal with, but can also be a huge nuisance when they're trying to get out. I was an infantry PL for about 20 months, so I had guys in only wanting to do 3 years, and the last two years of their career were full of toxicity and ruining the attitude of the news guys.

Advice for anyone reading this thread, do a lot of research and know what you're getting into. Joining the military isn't a noble endeavor, it's what you do while you're in that makes your service noble and can give you that 'bump'. Maybe OP will do awesome things and make a positive difference in the lives of a select few. Just know while you're in, the task at hand is serving, not counting down the days until you can go to law school.

To be helpful, you're welcome to PM me OP. I'll be happy to answer any questions.

WalkingContradiction
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby WalkingContradiction » Tue Aug 29, 2017 4:23 pm

It's largely been covered, but I want to reiterate that when you join the military, especially if you commission, it is not about you. Your needs become subordinate to the whole. Those who don't learn that can get people killed or make life miserable for those around them. If your motivation to join is that it will give you an OCI bump, you are not thinking through this decision properly. If you want to learn courage and social skills, go join a rugby team in your city.

Furthermore, you've already deferred a year. A normal military commitment is 3-4 years on active duty with another 4 or so in the inactive reserves. Law schools won't hold your slot for that long. Are you thinking of joining the reserves or national guard during this deferment? You're probably too late in the game to do so and be ready for school, but a recruiter would know better. The military bump comes from the experience you get though. And you really wouldnt have much in the way of experience if all you have done is basic training and a few weekend drills when you start law school.

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Kali the Annihilator
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby Kali the Annihilator » Tue Aug 29, 2017 4:30 pm

Posting in a derp thread.

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BlendedUnicorn
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Re: [Please delete this thread]

Postby BlendedUnicorn » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:04 pm

pikachoo wrote:Moderator please delete this thread.

I don't feel comfortable with the aggressive outing of my private information by UVA2B.

Please delete this thread


1: this is why we have a report function. We're way more likely to see something like this if you use it.

2: please report the post you're referring to so we can decide what action needs to be taken.

As a general rule, we don't delete threads. If there's personal information of yours ITT, we might make an exception but I'll be honest I read through this whole thing and don't see anything remotely close to that.

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Nebby
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby Nebby » Tue Aug 29, 2017 6:11 pm

UVA2B wrote:
pikachoo wrote:
UVA2B wrote:
pikachoo wrote:
Dcc617 wrote:
malleus discentium wrote:
pikachoo wrote:Does anyone know if US military veterans receive any boost when it comes to hiring/clerkships?

I am considering joining the US Army and I will be WAY older (30s) than most 0Ls. In addition to the financail aid help from the GI bill, I was wondering if top firms/clerkships would give any boost to T14 graduates wih military experience.

Thank you in advance!

Are you deciding whether to join the army based on how it will affect your legal hiring prospects??


Oh god, I assumed this was a person thinking of leaving the military. OP, please don't join the military for a law school bump.


I've already been accepted to law school.

I was curious about the employment prospects with military experience under your belt.


But do you have military experience now that you've been accepted to law school, or are you thinking of joining in hopes of improving your outcomes out of law school? If the former, it gives a boost. If the latter, you're doing this wrong.


Latter. I've deferred for a year and am now seriously considering joining the army for a variety of reasons (to develop courage, social skills, team-work etc) and employment prospects of course rank high.

So.. are you saying military experience won't give much of a boost when it comes to OCI, clerkship hiring, etc?


No, that's not what I'm saying. I'm saying you shouldn't join the Army for any of the reasons you've given, because they are generally bad reasons to join. And when you suggest employment prospects rank high, I'm doubly concerned about you joining.

I'm going to take a strong stance: don't join the military if you don't want to serve the country at no benefit to you. Even though there are incredible benefits in serving the country, if you join the Army (or any of the services, fwiw) with a sole intention of improving your job prospects or other pretty much meaningless intangibles, you will be disappointed. You're not going to magically find courage, social skills, or teamwork simply because you joined the military. And those deficiencies won't be masked simply because you joined the Army.

Look, joining the military is a serious commitment. It could be a four year commitment, followed by Harvard and a successful private career. But you shouldn't enter the profession thinking that. It's not a resume line. If you think it is, you're doing a disservice to anyone who serves with you.

Everything is a resume line

cavalier1138
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Re: [Please delete this thread]

Postby cavalier1138 » Tue Aug 29, 2017 7:14 pm

Yeah, aside from being outed as someone who wants to join the fucking Army for a resume boost, I don't see any personal information on here. You've been outed as ridiculous, but your secret identity remains intact.

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UVA2B
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby UVA2B » Tue Aug 29, 2017 7:54 pm

Nebby wrote:Everything is a resume line


That's true, but there is an important difference between joining the military for good reasons and putting it on your resume after you've served and solely joining the military for the resume line. One is entirely admirable and encouraged; the other leads down a path of professional misery for the person and anyone serving beside them more often than not.

I sincerely doubt the OP will read this because they felt I personally assaulted their existence on this site, but just to be clear: people regularly join the military for bad reasons, and that shouldn't be judged or even chastised, but it can be warned against. The OP shouldn't join the military unless they have better, unstated reasons for doing it beyond wanting to boost their resume or fare better in hiring afterward. Similar plans happen, and even worse plans happen regularly in people joining the military, but that doesn't make them advisable. So in my finite opinion on this, I just want to make clear: those serving for reasons that have little to do with a sense of duty to country and a genuine desire to serve are most often miserable while serving AND miserable to serve beside.

Anyway, this is all moot because this thread will soon be a ghost devoid of any helpful, substantive information.

cavalier1138
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Re: How do US military veterans do during hiring?

Postby cavalier1138 » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:04 pm

UVA2B wrote:Anyway, this is all moot because this thread will soon be a ghost devoid of any helpful, substantive information.


All those posts will be lost, in time, like tears in rain. Time... to die.

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A. Nony Mouse
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Re: [Please delete this thread]

Postby A. Nony Mouse » Tue Aug 29, 2017 8:31 pm

pikachoo wrote:Moderator please delete this thread.

I don't feel comfortable with the aggressive outing of my private information by UVA2B.

Please delete this thread

I don't remember seeing anything at all outing; commenting on something you chose to post doesn't out you (and that would be pretty inconsistent with UVA2B's usual posting). There certainly isn't any private information here now.

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Kali the Annihilator
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Re: [Please delete this thread]

Postby Kali the Annihilator » Tue Aug 29, 2017 9:26 pm

Dont join the army, precious.




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