0L Advice? Forum

[Caesar Salad]

I have messaged everyone on this thread. I believe it is in everyone's interest to comply by the end of the day.

Can I get a message?

[A. Nony Mouse]

I have messaged everyone on this thread. I believe it is in everyone's interest to comply by the end of the day.

No, it isn't. You can ask people to edit out your posts as a courtesy. You can't make them do so, and it has nothing to do with their interests. You can't threaten people over quoting material that you voluntarily posted on the internet. Stop.

[cavalier1138]

I have messaged everyone on this thread. I believe it is in everyone's interest to comply by the end of the day.

I didn't get a message. Please resend with firm letterhead.

[ConLaw2017]

I have messaged everyone on this thread. I believe it is in everyone's interest to comply by the end of the day.

No, it isn't. You can ask people to edit out your posts as a courtesy. You can't make them do so, and it has nothing to do with their interests. You can't threaten people over quoting material that you voluntarily posted on the internet. Stop.

I am not threatening people and I fully recognize that they can choose whether they want to take their posts down. I edited my posts out because others requested that I do so. But, I did not anticipate that this thread would continue and distort the original message that I posted.
There are something things that are more important in life than making money: standing for your principles and standing up to bullies.

Slavery is wrong.

Every person is entitled to basic human dignity.

Sex discrimination is wrong.

Race discrimination is wrong.

Acting out in foolish ways because of jealousy or insecurity about one's own shortcomings is wrong.

Finally, telling someone how to live their life and urging them to give up on their dreams before they have even started because you unfortunately experienced disappointment in your life and you have incomplete information about their circumstances, while not categorically incorrect, is inappropriate.

During this thread, I have encountered folks who have urged or engaged in everyone of these arguments. I cannot stand by and allow others to make these posts, distort this debate, and delegitimize my narrative, which is true or at the very least needs to be told and should not be ignored. If I have not been treated correctly and feel that way, no one has right to come in, tell me what I saw (when they were not there), and tell me how to feel about. I am a human being who is capable of doing that on my own volition. And for someone to engage this way not only suggests that they disagree with this premise but are willing to engage in extreme condescension.

So I will respond to these new posts and tell my story.

[cavalier1138]

I have messaged everyone on this thread. I believe it is in everyone's interest to comply by the end of the day.

No, it isn't. You can ask people to edit out your posts as a courtesy. You can't make them do so, and it has nothing to do with their interests. You can't threaten people over quoting material that you voluntarily posted on the internet. Stop.

I am not threatening people and I fully recognize that they can choose whether they want to take their posts down. I edited my posts out because others requested that I do so. But, I did not anticipate that this thread would continue and distort the original message that I posted.
There are something things that are more important in life than making money: standing for your principles and standing up to bullies.

Slavery is wrong.

Every person is entitled to basic human dignity.

Sex discrimination is wrong.

Race discrimination is wrong.

Acting out in foolish ways because of jealousy or insecurity about one's own shortcomings is wrong.

Finally, telling someone how to live their life and urging them to give up on their dreams before they have even started because you unfortunately experienced disappointment in your life and you have incomplete information about their circumstances, while not categorically incorrect, is inappropriate.

During this thread, I have encountered folks who have urged or engaged in everyone of these arguments. I cannot stand by and allow others to make these posts, distort this debate, and delegitimize my narrative, which is true or at the very least needs to be told and should not be ignored. If I have not been treated correctly and feel that way, no one has right to come in, tell me what I saw (when they were not there), and tell me how to feel about. I am a human being who is capable of doing that on my own volition. And for someone to engage this way not only suggests that they disagree with this premise but are willing to engage in extreme condescension.

So I will respond to these new posts and tell my story.

Quoting for posterity.

[njdevils2626]

Out of curiosity, is there any way to get push notifications to my phone or something any time this guy posts? Every single one of his threads has 100% delivered. I want to be here for all of them

[A. Nony Mouse]

Dude, you can tell whatever story you want. I didn't say anything about that. I'm telling you not to PM people about this thread and state that it's "in their best interests to comply" with whatever it is you asked. That's threatening people, you don't get to do that.

If you want to continue to analogize biglaw to slavery, go right ahead, it's your funeral.

[ConLaw2017]

Dude, you can tell whatever story you want. I didn't say anything about that. I'm telling you not to PM people about this thread and state that it's "in their best interests to comply" with whatever it is you asked. That's threatening people, you don't get to do that.

If you want to continue to analogize biglaw to slavery, go right ahead, it's your funeral.

I am not analogizing every BigLaw experience to slavery because that would be laughable. Biglaw is a huge institution and there are good and bad actors within it like there are with every institution of that nature. All I am saying is that it is wrong for anyone (including folks in Biglaw) to treat someone as if they do not have or are not deserving of basic human respect. I don't understand why this is such a big deal.

[Nebby]

Amazing thread

[0heL]

Dude, you can tell whatever story you want. I didn't say anything about that. I'm telling you not to PM people about this thread and state that it's "in their best interests to comply" with whatever it is you asked. That's threatening people, you don't get to do that.

If you want to continue to analogize biglaw to slavery, go right ahead, it's your funeral.

I am not analogizing every BigLaw experience to slavery because that would be laughable. Biglaw is a huge institution and there are good and bad actors within it like there are with every institution of that nature. All I am saying is that it is wrong for anyone (including folks in Biglaw) to treat someone as if they do not have or are not deserving of basic human respect. I don't understand why this is such a big deal.

I think the most unobjectionably racist thing you accused your law firm of doing was referring to you with racial slurs. What did they say?

[ConLaw2017]

Hey man,

So apparently you're real. You seem to have gone underground but since you seem to be intent upon destroying your legal career before its even started, thought I would chime in. As someone who is what the kids these days call a "double minority" (read: pretty into race/class/gender analysis) and who is ahead of you at another T14 (basically, someone who is familiar with some of the spaces and challenges you're navigating), if how you've been conducting yourself on here is how you are in real life, I would be very uninterested in hiring or mentoring you. I'd advise taking notary public off your work experience before you get laughed out of law school and also your LSAT as not only is it considered crass to announce it, yours is on the low side for Yale. Finally, if you're working where I think you are, even if absolutely every "terrible" thing you described happened, you are SOL as they have an excellently curated progressive reputation. What strategies to pursue in that sort of situation where you are going up against an institutional behemoth can be learned in law school, but if you learned those in your 20 law classes at Stanford, you don't appear to be deploying them. This leads me to think there might yet be something for you to learn in school and from the world. I'd meditate on that.

Thank you for your input. Could you please tell me what I have done or said that makes you come to this conclusion? I do not understand why being candid and honest about what I have seen as one of the few persons of color in my workplace and preserving my career are mutually exclusive. Also, I don't know what you are talking about regarding Linkedin. Finally, if we have the same institution in mind, I sincerely doubt that this progressive reputation you speak of is controlling. Unless we define progressive has meaning that the business has had several race and sex discrimination suits brought against it and has minimal non-majority representation. Facts matter. Why is this so controversial?

[ConLaw2017]

Dude, you can tell whatever story you want. I didn't say anything about that. I'm telling you not to PM people about this thread and state that it's "in their best interests to comply" with whatever it is you asked. That's threatening people, you don't get to do that.

If you want to continue to analogize biglaw to slavery, go right ahead, it's your funeral.

I am not analogizing every BigLaw experience to slavery because that would be laughable. Biglaw is a huge institution and there are good and bad actors within it like there are with every institution of that nature. All I am saying is that it is wrong for anyone (including folks in Biglaw) to treat someone as if they do not have or are not deserving of basic human respect. I don't understand why this is such a big deal.

I think the most unobjectionably racist thing you accused your law firm of doing was referring to you with racial slurs. What did they say?

I was told to go back to another continent (which I am not from).

[0heL]

Dude, you can tell whatever story you want. I didn't say anything about that. I'm telling you not to PM people about this thread and state that it's "in their best interests to comply" with whatever it is you asked. That's threatening people, you don't get to do that.

If you want to continue to analogize biglaw to slavery, go right ahead, it's your funeral.

I am not analogizing every BigLaw experience to slavery because that would be laughable. Biglaw is a huge institution and there are good and bad actors within it like there are with every institution of that nature. All I am saying is that it is wrong for anyone (including folks in Biglaw) to treat someone as if they do not have or are not deserving of basic human respect. I don't understand why this is such a big deal.

I think the most unobjectionably racist thing you accused your law firm of doing was referring to you with racial slurs. What did they say?

I was told to go back to another continent (which I am not from).

By a partner/associate at the firm? That's pretty bad

[ConLaw2017]

Dude, you can tell whatever story you want. I didn't say anything about that. I'm telling you not to PM people about this thread and state that it's "in their best interests to comply" with whatever it is you asked. That's threatening people, you don't get to do that.

If you want to continue to analogize biglaw to slavery, go right ahead, it's your funeral.

I am not analogizing every BigLaw experience to slavery because that would be laughable. Biglaw is a huge institution and there are good and bad actors within it like there are with every institution of that nature. All I am saying is that it is wrong for anyone (including folks in Biglaw) to treat someone as if they do not have or are not deserving of basic human respect. I don't understand why this is such a big deal.

I think the most unobjectionably racist thing you accused your law firm of doing was referring to you with racial slurs. What did they say?

I was told to go back to another continent (which I am not from).

By a partner/associate at the firm? That's pretty bad

Yes, it was. I am not going to comment though on whether this person is a partner, associate, summer, or counsel - because that was not this thread's original purpose. For all we know, no one even knows which firm I am at. I recognize that my style is not for everyone and everyplace. We are all flawed. I am presumptuous, over-confident, and tend to obsess over planning. That does not mean there is not a place outside biglaw (or in biglaw) for me. All I wanted from this thread was career advice and pointers but what I got was a bunch of trolling and comments on my personal defects (some of which came from folks who honestly should have stayed out of this conversation).

[barkschool]

not OP, but I'm trying to get a concentration in federal district court appointment

I've got some pretty special skills and circumstances

[+] Spoiler

but I can't explain them, because I don't want to make you jealous. And, let's be honest you don't understand

I've been working on my ability to interact with others for years now, but to be honest, no one understands how I feel

Is it unlikely that I'm the problem, yes.

Is it unlikely that my attitude is causing some personality conflicts at work, yes.

I could use advice by COB today, thanks.




I'm looking for something specific, don't give advice I'm not looking for or I'll argue with it. Thanks in advance.

[ConLaw2017]

not OP, but I'm trying to get a concentration in federal district court appointment

I've got some pretty special skills and circumstances

[+] Spoiler

but I can't explain them, because I don't want to make you jealous. And, let's be honest you don't understand

I've been working on my ability to interact with others for years now, but to be honest, no one understands how I feel

Is it unlikely that I'm the problem, yes.

Is it unlikely that my attitude is causing some personality conflicts at work, yes.

I could use advice by COB today, thanks.

I don't dispute that my personality is causing some problems. If you feel so confident about this, given what I went through, how would you have reacted to this situation? It was not irrational or even unreasonable for me to do what I did.

I'm looking for something specific, don't give advice I'm not looking for or I'll argue with it. Thanks in advance.

I don't dispute that my personality is causing some of these problems. But given what I went through, it was not illogical or even unreasonable for me to act the way I did. Why don't you tell me what you would have done differently?

[TooMuchTuna]

not OP, but I'm trying to get a concentration in federal district court appointment

I've got some pretty special skills and circumstances

[+] Spoiler

but I can't explain them, because I don't want to make you jealous. And, let's be honest you don't understand

I've been working on my ability to interact with others for years now, but to be honest, no one understands how I feel

Is it unlikely that I'm the problem, yes.

Is it unlikely that my attitude is causing some personality conflicts at work, yes.

I could use advice by COB today, thanks.

I don't dispute that my personality is causing some problems. If you feel so confident about this, given what I went through, how would you have reacted to this situation? It was not irrational or even unreasonable for me to do what I did.

I'm looking for something specific, don't give advice I'm not looking for or I'll argue with it. Thanks in advance.

I don't dispute that my personality is causing some of these problems. But given what I went through, it was not illogical or even unreasonable for me to act the way I did. Why don't you tell me what you would have done differently?

I imagine your personality is causing more than just some of the problems you experienced here and in your life generally.

[ConLaw2017]

not OP, but I'm trying to get a concentration in federal district court appointment

I've got some pretty special skills and circumstances

[+] Spoiler

but I can't explain them, because I don't want to make you jealous. And, let's be honest you don't understand

I've been working on my ability to interact with others for years now, but to be honest, no one understands how I feel

Is it unlikely that I'm the problem, yes.

Is it unlikely that my attitude is causing some personality conflicts at work, yes.

I could use advice by COB today, thanks.

I don't dispute that my personality is causing some problems. If you feel so confident about this, given what I went through, how would you have reacted to this situation? It was not irrational or even unreasonable for me to do what I did.

I'm looking for something specific, don't give advice I'm not looking for or I'll argue with it. Thanks in advance.

I don't dispute that my personality is causing some of these problems. But given what I went through, it was not illogical or even unreasonable for me to act the way I did. Why don't you tell me what you would have done differently?

I imagine your personality is causing more than just some of the problems you experienced here and in your life generally.

My life is actually better than most so it has not reached there yet - I am thankful for that. But, its not my fault that someone tells me to go back to Africa. Its not my fault that someone randomly comes up to my office and blasts Harry Styles' Sign of the Times and dances like a school girl in front of my office. It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

It is my fault that others don't know why I am acting the way I am. It is my fault that some folks were rubbed the wrong way. And it is my fault that others who I do grunt work for don't know how much I appreciate them and am willing to sacrifice my time to help in anyway I can. How do I fix this? If I were planning on suing these folks for genuinely hated them, this vitriol would make sense. But, I don't hate any of these people (honest to god). I just came in, tried to do my job the best I could, and in a fortnight all hell broke lose. What do I do?

[cavalier1138]

It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

I thought that was something you were doing by choice?

[ConLaw2017]

It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

I thought that was something you were doing by choice?

Yes and no. It was a choice in the sense that I originally did it because I wanted to make a good impression, combat stereotypes in a WASP profession, and prove my worth. It was not a choice in the sense that once I stopped, others started pressuring me to re-start. Someone even went so far to suggest that I would be fired - and I didn't want to make my program look bad and take this opportunity from a successor who probably wants biglaw and does not have better exit options.

[cavalier1138]

It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

I thought that was something you were doing by choice?

Yes and no. It was a choice in the sense that I originally did it because I wanted to make a good impression, combat stereotypes in a WASP profession, and prove my worth. It was not a choice in the sense that once I stopped, others started pressuring me to re-start. Someone even went so far to suggest that I would be fired - and I didn't want to make my program look bad and take this opportunity from a successor who probably wants biglaw and does not have better exit options.

Fascinating. Tell us more.

[ConLaw2017]

It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

I thought that was something you were doing by choice?

Yes and no. It was a choice in the sense that I originally did it because I wanted to make a good impression, combat stereotypes in a WASP profession, and prove my worth. It was not a choice in the sense that once I stopped, others started pressuring me to re-start. Someone even went so far to suggest that I would be fired - and I didn't want to make my program look bad and take this opportunity from a successor who probably wants biglaw and does not have better exit options.

Fascinating. Tell us more.

About what?

[cavalier1138]

It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

I thought that was something you were doing by choice?

Yes and no. It was a choice in the sense that I originally did it because I wanted to make a good impression, combat stereotypes in a WASP profession, and prove my worth. It was not a choice in the sense that once I stopped, others started pressuring me to re-start. Someone even went so far to suggest that I would be fired - and I didn't want to make my program look bad and take this opportunity from a successor who probably wants biglaw and does not have better exit options.

Fascinating. Tell us more.

About what?

Everything.

[njdevils2626]

Genuinely curious what Harry Styles has done to you personally for you to have such a violent reaction to his music being played in your vicinity. That story sounds hilarious, I wish a partner blasted music and danced in front of my office, that's a super uplifting way to start the day

[A. Nony Mouse]

It's not my fault that I have to work from 8-11 when no other similarly situated person has to.

I thought that was something you were doing by choice?

Yes and no. It was a choice in the sense that I originally did it because I wanted to make a good impression, combat stereotypes in a WASP profession, and prove my worth. It was not a choice in the sense that once I stopped, others started pressuring me to re-start. Someone even went so far to suggest that I would be fired - and I didn't want to make my program look bad and take this opportunity from a successor who probably wants biglaw and does not have better exit options.

How, exactly, precisely, did they suggest that you would be fired from an 8-week program when they can just wait you out and be rid of you?

I agree that being told to go back to Africa is bad and I'm sorry someone thought that was appropriate to say to you.