Columbia students taking questions Forum

[Bronck]

^ Correct. Not necessarily sure if it'll be exactly the same next year, they tend to tinker with it year by year. But generally speaking, if you do public interest (typically nonprofit/gov't) like the majority of 1Ls, then you'll get a meager-ish stipend from Columbia. If you score a firm gig, then you get paid. If you clerk for a judge...

...

....then you're screwed? How would you finance 1L summer at that point?

Well it's just a matter of personal preference. If you can afford to not get paid and you think the experience is worth it, then go for it. I didn't even apply, because that wasn't my situation. It's not something too many people do. That being said, I'll probably end up doing public interest and the "stipend" won't even cover my rent over the summer.

Hmmm, okay. Are there a lot of 1L PI positions available in NYC (especially for someone with very little WE)? I don't think I'd be able to afford not getting paid over 1L summer unless I was very frugal and saved up loan money throughout the year.

[mel2010]

Hmmm, okay. Are there a lot of 1L PI positions available in NYC (especially for someone with very little WE)? I don't think I'd be able to afford not getting paid over 1L summer unless I was very frugal and saved up loan money throughout the year.

Yes, there are. I think it really just depends on how wide of a net you're willing to cast. For one thing, I'd definitely recommend sending your applications in early. And if you have Shaw for civpro, send in your applications to places that require transcripts early and tell them you'll update them with grades.

But like I was saying, it's a matter of what you're willing to do. Some things are rather competitive (certain DA offices, etc) but ultimately any government office or nonprofit organization you work for will probably qualify for the summer stipend. And there is lots of government and many nonprofits in New York. You can also consider going home and working for an organization there, if you're not from 'round here.

[Bronck]

Hmmm, okay. Are there a lot of 1L PI positions available in NYC (especially for someone with very little WE)? I don't think I'd be able to afford not getting paid over 1L summer unless I was very frugal and saved up loan money throughout the year.

Yes, there are. I think it really just depends on how wide of a net you're willing to cast. For one thing, I'd definitely recommend sending your applications in early. And if you have Shaw for civpro, send in your applications to places that require transcripts early and tell them you'll update them with grades.

But like I was saying, it's a matter of what you're willing to do. Some things are rather competitive (certain DA offices, etc) but ultimately any government office or nonprofit organization you work for will probably qualify for the summer stipend. And there is lots of government and many nonprofits in New York. You can also consider going home and working for an organization there, if you're not from 'round here.

That's great to hear!

One last question along this line of thought: does CLS provide summer housing? I know NYU does. If not, what living options are there for the summer?

[redsoxfan2495]

Hmmm, okay. Are there a lot of 1L PI positions available in NYC (especially for someone with very little WE)? I don't think I'd be able to afford not getting paid over 1L summer unless I was very frugal and saved up loan money throughout the year.

Yes, there are. I think it really just depends on how wide of a net you're willing to cast. For one thing, I'd definitely recommend sending your applications in early. And if you have Shaw for civpro, send in your applications to places that require transcripts early and tell them you'll update them with grades.

But like I was saying, it's a matter of what you're willing to do. Some things are rather competitive (certain DA offices, etc) but ultimately any government office or nonprofit organization you work for will probably qualify for the summer stipend. And there is lots of government and many nonprofits in New York. You can also consider going home and working for an organization there, if you're not from 'round here.

That's great to hear!

One last question along this line of thought: does CLS provide summer housing? I know NYU does. If not, what living options are there for the summer?

I think most people just stay in the same apartment they've been living in all year and continue to pay rent throughout the summer.

[birdlaw117]

Hmmm, okay. Are there a lot of 1L PI positions available in NYC (especially for someone with very little WE)? I don't think I'd be able to afford not getting paid over 1L summer unless I was very frugal and saved up loan money throughout the year.

Yes, there are. I think it really just depends on how wide of a net you're willing to cast. For one thing, I'd definitely recommend sending your applications in early. And if you have Shaw for civpro, send in your applications to places that require transcripts early and tell them you'll update them with grades.

But like I was saying, it's a matter of what you're willing to do. Some things are rather competitive (certain DA offices, etc) but ultimately any government office or nonprofit organization you work for will probably qualify for the summer stipend. And there is lots of government and many nonprofits in New York. You can also consider going home and working for an organization there, if you're not from 'round here.

That's great to hear!

One last question along this line of thought: does CLS provide summer housing? I know NYU does. If not, what living options are there for the summer?

I'm at NYU, but the NYU housing would be available for CLS students (I think) over the summer.

[Bronck]

What about grocery shopping in MH?

I didn't notice very many options when I checked on Yelp.

[Guchster]

What about grocery shopping in MH?

I didn't notice very many options when I checked on Yelp.

Some good options. A few subway stops gets you along way too (trader joe's/fairway on 72/74th)

Most of these places are within 7-10 blocks of one another centered around the law school.
Morton Williams
West Side Market
D'ag
Garden of Eden
Fairway market
Appletree Market (kinda make shift grocery store but more of a glamorized deli)

There's a good place down the stairs in Harlem on ~117th and Fred Doug (Best Yet Market. I go there cuz its cheap and good deli meat/seafood)

ETA: Some people are a big fan of fresh direct

[Tadatsune]

the perfection and efficiency of our well-oiled greedy OCS which handles Big Law (our OCS is a mean, green fighting machine of a mother fucker that could've fixed the recession single-handedly because they're so hardcore).

This is, I think, the first time I have heard ardent praise for Columbia's OCS. Most of the reviews I have encountered have been lackluster, which has been a point of concern. Obviously, with CLS's employment stats something must be going right, but still...

I'd appreciate if CLS students (I know the thread says 1Ls, but any 2Ls out there?) could elaborate on OCS for me...

[mel2010]

the perfection and efficiency of our well-oiled greedy OCS which handles Big Law (our OCS is a mean, green fighting machine of a mother fucker that could've fixed the recession single-handedly because they're so hardcore).

This is, I think, the first time I have heard ardent praise for Columbia's OCS. Most of the reviews I have encountered have been lackluster, which has been a point of concern. Obviously, with CLS's employment stats something must be going right, but still...

I'd appreciate if CLS students (I know the thread says 1Ls, but any 2Ls out there?) could elaborate on OCS for me...

Well, just a 1L here. My limited experiences with OCS have been fine. Basically, they do what they do...I don't know that they know any secrets that OCS at any other school doesn't know, though. They can look for typos, show you various employment databases, and tell you generally what to emphasize or leave out of your applications...

[kwais]

the perfection and efficiency of our well-oiled greedy OCS which handles Big Law (our OCS is a mean, green fighting machine of a mother fucker that could've fixed the recession single-handedly because they're so hardcore).

This is, I think, the first time I have heard ardent praise for Columbia's OCS. Most of the reviews I have encountered have been lackluster, which has been a point of concern. Obviously, with CLS's employment stats something must be going right, but still...

I'd appreciate if CLS students (I know the thread says 1Ls, but any 2Ls out there?) could elaborate on OCS for me...

Well, just a 1L here. My limited experiences with OCS have been fine. Basically, they do what they do...I don't know that they know any secrets that OCS at any other school doesn't know, though. They can look for typos, show you various employment databases, and tell you generally what to emphasize or leave out of your applications...

Agreed, they are neither going to get you your job nor keep you from it. They are a resource and nothing more. Use Spring OCI, NYU fair, word of mouth, 2Ls and 3Ls, databases and the general internet to get jobs. I'm not sure what its like at other schools, but as long as you do not rely on them exclusively, then they can be helpful.

[Tadatsune]

Any support/resources for international SA positions?

[Guchster]

Any support/resources for international SA positions?

Hmm... haven't really checked symplicity (our jerbs website) for this specifically. But i know Paul Weiss advertised SA positions in Tokyo and Beijing. I've also seen fellowships for stuff in Japan, Singapore, and Hong Kong. Haven't seen much for UK/Latin America though.

I mean, like kwais says, OCS/SJI can help as much as you want them to. I'm sure you could ask them to help you find resources. I've actually found OCS at CLS to be incredibly helpful. As you can read in the 1L summer employment thread, I profited hardcore for 1L SA in my home market and NYC. I attribute a lot of this to my OCS counselor. She gave me tips on finding these jerbs, sent me special fellowships, helped me solidify and perfect my resume and cover letters, practiced interviewing with me, etc. She also wouldn't have done shit if I didn't ask her to help. With most things in life, the resource will work for you only as much as you make it.

I know a decent number of people who find PI werk abroad. Not sure about SA positions. SA positions don't really exist as a 1L in US unless you're a URM (which is broader than the law school application definition--i.e., women, lgbt, sometimes asian, etc). Don't know what this looks like outside of US

[crazi4law]

How is the social scene for a 22 year old 1L? Is it easy to meet people and make friends?

[NC1]

How is the social scene for a 22 year old 1L? Is it easy to meet people and make friends?

1/3 of the class of 2014 is straight out of undergrad. You'll be fine.

[Guchster]

How is the social scene for a 22 year old 1L? Is it easy to meet people and make friends?

our class is very social. if making friends and going out if your thing, there is plenty of opportunity to do so. You have three weeks of legal methods to make a lot of friends and start developing your circle of buddies. Also, once the semester starts, you'll make friends with the people in the orgs you become involved with.

also, our class uses our facebook group often to get together/parties/plan stuff, etc.--plenty of opportunities.

[bhan87]

Any support/resources for international SA positions?

Hmm... haven't really checked symplicity (our jerbs website) for this specifically. But i know Paul Weiss advertised SA positions in Tokyo and Beijing. I've also seen fellowships for stuff in Japan, Singapore, and Hong Kong. Haven't seen much for UK/Latin America though.

I mean, like kwais says, OCS/SJI can help as much as you want them to. I'm sure you could ask them to help you find resources. I've actually found OCS at CLS to be incredibly helpful. As you can read in the 1L summer employment thread, I profited hardcore for 1L SA in my home market and NYC. I attribute a lot of this to my OCS counselor. She gave me tips on finding these jerbs, sent me special fellowships, helped me solidify and perfect my resume and cover letters, practiced interviewing with me, etc. She also wouldn't have done shit if I didn't ask her to help. With most things in life, the resource will work for you only as much as you make it.

I know a decent number of people who find PI werk abroad. Not sure about SA positions. SA positions don't really exist as a 1L in US unless you're a URM (which is broader than the law school application definition--i.e., women, lgbt, sometimes asian, etc). Don't know what this looks like outside of US

Lots of resources for Japan positions specifically (can't speak to other countries in great detail). For Japan, there were numerous Japanese firms that offered paid positions to CLS 1Ls this year (Nishimura Asahi, tmi associates, Paul Weiss Tokyo, Matsuo & Kosugi, Momo-o Matsuo & Namba, Sakura Kyodo, etc.). The Center for Japanese Legal studies also offers two $10,000 summer fellowships for public interest work. Because Japan is a pretty niche market, these offerings essentially guaranteed that all the 1Ls really interested in working in Japan over the summer was guaranteed a position.

I've also heard Kim & Chang (the top Korean firm) hired multiple CLS 1Ls for summer associate positions and I'm sure China has similar positions as well.

[snehpets]

Going to be visiting this coming Thursday afternoon and want to visit a class. Any suggestions? Also, how awkward is doing this?

[Guchster]

Going to be visiting this coming Thursday afternoon and want to visit a class. Any suggestions? Also, how awkward is doing this?

Not awkward at all. People really like the admits and like showing them around. Let them see your name tag and people will strike up convos/give you advice about what classes to visit etc.

Just take a seat at the back. If you take someone's seat they can probably point you in the direction of one that's open.

[Tadatsune]

Any support/resources for international SA positions?

Hmm... haven't really checked symplicity (our jerbs website) for this specifically. But i know Paul Weiss advertised SA positions in Tokyo and Beijing. I've also seen fellowships for stuff in Japan, Singapore, and Hong Kong. Haven't seen much for UK/Latin America though.

I mean, like kwais says, OCS/SJI can help as much as you want them to. I'm sure you could ask them to help you find resources. I've actually found OCS at CLS to be incredibly helpful. As you can read in the 1L summer employment thread, I profited hardcore for 1L SA in my home market and NYC. I attribute a lot of this to my OCS counselor. She gave me tips on finding these jerbs, sent me special fellowships, helped me solidify and perfect my resume and cover letters, practiced interviewing with me, etc. She also wouldn't have done shit if I didn't ask her to help. With most things in life, the resource will work for you only as much as you make it.

I know a decent number of people who find PI werk abroad. Not sure about SA positions. SA positions don't really exist as a 1L in US unless you're a URM (which is broader than the law school application definition--i.e., women, lgbt, sometimes asian, etc). Don't know what this looks like outside of US

Lots of resources for Japan positions specifically (can't speak to other countries in great detail). For Japan, there were numerous Japanese firms that offered paid positions to CLS 1Ls this year (Nishimura Asahi, TMI Associates, Paul Weiss Tokyo, Matsuo & Kosugi, Momo-o Matsuo & Namba, Sakura Kyodo, etc.). The Center for Japanese Legal studies also offers two $10,000 summer fellowships for public interest work. Because Japan is a pretty niche market, these offerings essentially guaranteed that all the 1Ls really interested in working in Japan over the summer was guaranteed a position.

I've also heard Kim & Chang (the top Korean firm) hired multiple CLS 1Ls for summer associate positions and I'm sure China has similar positions as well.

Thanks!

[piccolittle]

Going to be visiting this coming Thursday afternoon and want to visit a class. Any suggestions? Also, how awkward is doing this?

Not awkward at all. People really like the admits and like showing them around. Let them see your name tag and people will strike up convos/give you advice about what classes to visit etc.

Just take a seat at the back. If you take someone's seat they can probably point you in the direction of one that's open.

Also, in terms of the best classes to visit:

9:10 Con Law with Jamal Greene - JG 103 (my class)
10:40 Property with Elizabeth Scott - JG 103 (also my class, obviously I like my profs)
Crim Law with Lynch (not sure what time/where that is - can anyone help?)
Maybe Moglen if that class meets on Thursdays?

Those would be my recommendations in order to get a good sense of the quality of the professors for 1L classes. Anyone who can help with the days/times those classes meet would be helpful, or any other suggestions.

You should also try to attend one of the many lunch events on Thursday. It looks like the lineup for those is this so far:

12:00 - 1:00 PM A Conversation With Former National Political Director of the DNC (JG 101)
12:10 - 1:00 PM Weakening of the Article III Judiciary (JG 105)
12:10 - 1:10 PM Economic Sanctions Against Iran and Syria (JG 807)
12:10 - 1:10 PM Navigating the Clerkship Process as a Public Interest Student (Big Warren 103)

Bear in mind, that Thursday is the day before most people leave for spring break, so anything unusual might be related to that (low attendance, general stupidity in classes).

Hope that helps! Feel free to PM me if you are going to be around and feel like a coffee/general tour or anything like that.

[camelcrema]

Maybe Moglen if that class meets on Thursdays?

Moglen class meets Thursdays 1:20-2:40 in JG101. However, I would not recommend this for anyone looking to sit in on a class even remotely resembling a typical law school class.

[kwais]

Lynch (second circuit judge) CrimLaw class is 4:40, room 101. Excellent class to observe

[bosox777]

Maybe Moglen if that class meets on Thursdays?

Moglen class meets Thursdays 1:20-2:40 in JG101. However, I would not recommend this for anyone looking to sit in on a class even remotely resembling a typical law school class.

Or for anyone looking to not get yelled at for 80 minutes straight by an absolute piece of shit.

[Guchster]

Maybe Moglen if that class meets on Thursdays?

Moglen class meets Thursdays 1:20-2:40 in JG101. However, I would not recommend this for anyone looking to sit in on a class even remotely resembling a typical law school class.

Or for anyone looking to not get yelled at for 80 minutes straight by an absolute piece of shit.

I'm in that class. It's hilarious and entertaining though. If you don't mind getting screamed at.

[timbs4339]

the perfection and efficiency of our well-oiled greedy OCS which handles Big Law (our OCS is a mean, green fighting machine of a mother fucker that could've fixed the recession single-handedly because they're so hardcore).

This is, I think, the first time I have heard ardent praise for Columbia's OCS. Most of the reviews I have encountered have been lackluster, which has been a point of concern. Obviously, with CLS's employment stats something must be going right, but still...

I'd appreciate if CLS students (I know the thread says 1Ls, but any 2Ls out there?) could elaborate on OCS for me...

Perhaps the best thing I can say about CLS OCS (I'm a current 3L) is that most people will never need to rely on them for advice. I've heard they are particularly bad among top schools, which is saying something because top schools generally have pretty poor OCS's. Luckily, job placement is pretty strong overall and most students can do just fine without their "help." My advice to you is to get in touch with as many 2L/3L students as you can and ask them for advice. Don't live in the 1L bubble where you only interact with other 1Ls. This is especially important before EIP. Absolutely do not listen to whatever OCS says without first running it by current students- they can sometimes give very poor bidding advice.

Also check out the Legal Employment forum here. CLS is very well represented come EIP time. And the general advice on there is good for people who have never done a real job search before.