Michigan 1Ls/2Ls/3Ls taking questions Forum

[verdandi]

As the proliferation of e-readers grows, do you guys expect most text books used in law school classes to go digital?

Unlikely. Those books are the bread and butter of many professors and publishers, so unless you are willing to shell out $$$ for a .pdf version of you currently hardback, gold-trimmed book, you probably won't be seeing any e-readable textbooks any time soon. I could also be a bit biased, in this view, because I find I do the best in class when I take notes in my books as well as in notebooks/on my computer. Many people do the "book brief" method (where you brief the case in the margins) but everyone has their own style. I personally would never go for an e-copy, even if it saved me a bundle of dough. Maybe the iPad will change all of that?

[parker09]

Completely anecdotal evidence, but I have a friend at CLS who turned down $$$ at Michigan and now regrets it because she doesn't really feel like she fits in there. HOWEVER this is not meant to be a knock at CLS, just evidence that some have made the decision of Mich over CLS and some wish they had. I didn't have the privilege of a CLS acceptance, but I did take Mich over NYU.

I cannot urge you strongly enough to visit both schools during their ASWs and get a feel for the schools and, almost more importantly, your potential future classmates. Good luck with your decision, you won't go wrong either way!

Haha, thanks everyone! Sorry to hijack the thread
I'm abroad and it'll cost me four digits worth of money (that I barely have) to visit... so I probably can't/won't (though I orbitz.com the ticket every week anyway just in case). That's why threads like this are so so so awesome.

[Alexandria]

As the proliferation of e-readers grows, do you guys expect most text books used in law school classes to go digital?

Unlikely. Those books are the bread and butter of many professors and publishers, so unless you are willing to shell out $$$ for a .pdf version of you currently hardback, gold-trimmed book, you probably won't be seeing any e-readable textbooks any time soon. I could also be a bit biased, in this view, because I find I do the best in class when I take notes in my books as well as in notebooks/on my computer. Many people do the "book brief" method (where you brief the case in the margins) but everyone has their own style. I personally would never go for an e-copy, even if it saved me a bundle of dough. Maybe the iPad will change all of that?

I've thought about this, too, and even though I only do a little highlighting in my books, I feel like having that highlighted text available in class to flip to quickly for specific points is really valuable (especially when you get called on). I'm not sure a reader could replace that aspect of a book.

[navalspartan]

In theory, the e-reader could enhance your ability to take notes "in the margin." You could also flip to a highlighted section almost easier with an enhanced CTR-F capability. I may end up being totally wrong but I am long on e-text books. I think that students will be heavily targeted by the iPad and the other entrants to the burgeoning tablet market. Text books will still cost a ton of money but I could see them selling the idea that even a 25% or so reduction in cost of e-books more than making up for the cost of the e-reader after 2-3 semesters.

[loveistheway]

long on e-readers (more for recreational reading though).
short on iPad.

Great thread though.

[vidhartha]

Have any of the current Michigan law students applied for or done an externship that was not a previously established program like the one in Geneva?

It seems like you could do some really cool stuff if you got faculty background. I would really appreciate some insight to the process.

Still a 1L here so I dont know much about externships, but I can ask around.

[rockchalk86]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

[verdandi]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

Yes! There is a student ticket package that includes ALL of the home football games. I did not buy it this year and I'm kicking myself - I'm definitely buying it next year. Even if you don't go to all of the games, there are always people (like me) who will buy your tickets off you. I think the package only costs $250-300, and you could actually probably make most of that back selling your Ohio State ticket alone.

And no, there is no excuse to miss out on football. I'd never been to a college football game before, and its been one of the best experiences I've had since I've been here. You can't study all the time. I did fine on finals and caught at least six games.

[vidhartha]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

There's plenty of time to make it to games and tailgating. It was my first time going to a college FB game this year and it was awesome, even if we fell apart as the season went along, it was still a great time. Tickets came as a package this year and theres a law student section so you will be around fellow law students. This past season they went for $25/ticket (the normal student rate), at 8 home games it was 200 for the package. Well worth it considering if you want to go to the big games (i.e. OSU) individual tix will go for around $200, or atleast they did this year.

And yeah, there is no excuse to miss the games, great chance to get together and just have a good time.

[Alexandria]

Have any of the current Michigan law students applied for or done an externship that was not a previously established program like the one in Geneva?

It seems like you could do some really cool stuff if you got faculty background. I would really appreciate some insight to the process.

Still a 1L here so I dont know much about externships, but I can ask around.

A close friend of mine did... he applied to various organizations that do GLBT work, and he got a couple offers and took one as an externship for last semester (3L fall).

[rockchalk86]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

There's plenty of time to make it to games and tailgating. It was my first time going to a college FB game this year and it was awesome, even if we fell apart as the season went along, it was still a great time. Tickets came as a package this year and theres a law student section so you will be around fellow law students. This past season they went for $25/ticket (the normal student rate), at 8 home games it was 200 for the package. Well worth it considering if you want to go to the big games (i.e. OSU) individual tix will go for around $200, or atleast they did this year.

And yeah, there is no excuse to miss the games, great chance to get together and just have a good time.

Awesome! I am so excited for Football. Plus, I may be one of the few people who can say they went the best place in America for NCAA basketball AND football!

[starstruck393]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

There's plenty of time to make it to games and tailgating. It was my first time going to a college FB game this year and it was awesome, even if we fell apart as the season went along, it was still a great time. Tickets came as a package this year and theres a law student section so you will be around fellow law students. This past season they went for $25/ticket (the normal student rate), at 8 home games it was 200 for the package. Well worth it considering if you want to go to the big games (i.e. OSU) individual tix will go for around $200, or atleast they did this year.

And yeah, there is no excuse to miss the games, great chance to get together and just have a good time.

Awesome! I am so excited for Football. Plus, I may be one of the few people who can say they went the best place in America for NCAA basketball AND football!

You didn't go to UNC

[rockchalk86]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

There's plenty of time to make it to games and tailgating. It was my first time going to a college FB game this year and it was awesome, even if we fell apart as the season went along, it was still a great time. Tickets came as a package this year and theres a law student section so you will be around fellow law students. This past season they went for $25/ticket (the normal student rate), at 8 home games it was 200 for the package. Well worth it considering if you want to go to the big games (i.e. OSU) individual tix will go for around $200, or atleast they did this year.

And yeah, there is no excuse to miss the games, great chance to get together and just have a good time.

Awesome! I am so excited for Football. Plus, I may be one of the few people who can say they went the best place in America for NCAA basketball AND football!

You didn't go to UNC

Don't even get me started on UNC and their traitor coach who shows up to the 08 championship wearing a jayhawk button after we utterly annihilated them the game before. Roy is scum. Rock Chalk Jayhawk!

[starstruck393]

Hey guys... thanks for answering questions. Is there a student ticket package for Law students for the Football games? Is it hard to find time to make it to the games and partake in the crazy tailgating? I figure if I go to Michigan, there is no excuse to miss out on Football.

There's plenty of time to make it to games and tailgating. It was my first time going to a college FB game this year and it was awesome, even if we fell apart as the season went along, it was still a great time. Tickets came as a package this year and theres a law student section so you will be around fellow law students. This past season they went for $25/ticket (the normal student rate), at 8 home games it was 200 for the package. Well worth it considering if you want to go to the big games (i.e. OSU) individual tix will go for around $200, or atleast they did this year.

And yeah, there is no excuse to miss the games, great chance to get together and just have a good time.

Awesome! I am so excited for Football. Plus, I may be one of the few people who can say they went the best place in America for NCAA basketball AND football!

You didn't go to UNC

Don't even get me started on UNC and their traitor coach who shows up to the 08 championship wearing a jayhawk button after we utterly annihilated them the game before. Roy is scum. Rock Chalk Jayhawk!

Haha

[s0ph1e2007]

Hey did any of you choose Michigan over Chicago?

Im talking to a Chicago grad tomorrow about this, but what I'm trying to decide is if I ought to ED chicago or not.

I'm applying to most of the T14 next year (yes i know this is early but I thought I might as well ask since you all seem so helpful) excluding some i just cant stand, NYU and Cornell and Berkeley.... but if I had my choice of all of those regardless of rank etc. I would pick Chicago or UofM.

Hearing someone's reasons for picking Mich over Chicago could help me decide to not ED at Chicago.

Thanks!

oh and just fyi, i bleed maize and blue so choosing chicago over UofM would be hard, but Chicago's reputation for conservative academia and their professors really seemed great

[Tangerine Gleam]

.

[EdmundBurke23]

Answers to any of the following would be greatly appreciated:D

1. Is it advisable to go for the early summer program and to graduate a semester earlier?
2. How does this affect employment from law firms?
3. How flexible are the externship opportunities?
4. What are the disadvantages to the large class size?

[Alexandria]

Hey did any of you choose Michigan over Chicago?

I mean... only in the sense that I didn't even apply to Chicago, and there's a decent chance I would have gotten in. It was just totally unappealing to me. For one thing, I didn't want to be in a big city for law school (mostly bc of cost of living). Second, the law and econ approach Chicago is known for sounded very unappealing to me (and now that I've had some exposure to it, I know I was right). Third, it simply doesn't have a reputation for having happy, friendly students.

That said, I know a couple people who went there, and they seem happy enough with their choice. That's the problem with picking a school... aside from transfers, no one you talk to has the experience of going both places.

Even now that I have some ideas of possibly pursuing academia someday, I'm glad I chose Michigan. There are certain professors I've had who have been extremely influential in helping shape my interests, and if I hadn't met them, I don't know exactly what shape my interests would have taken.

[Alexandria]

4. What are the disadvantages to the large class size?

Personally, I think it's an advantage, because it means more course offerings.

[RhubarbPie]

Hey did any of you choose Michigan over Chicago?

I mean... only in the sense that I didn't even apply to Chicago, and there's a decent chance I would have gotten in. It was just totally unappealing to me. For one thing, I didn't want to be in a big city for law school (mostly bc of cost of living). Second, the law and econ approach Chicago is known for sounded very unappealing to me (and now that I've had some exposure to it, I know I was right). Third, it simply doesn't have a reputation for having happy, friendly students.

That said, I know a couple people who went there, and they seem happy enough with their choice. That's the problem with picking a school... aside from transfers, no one you talk to has the experience of going both places.

Even now that I have some ideas of possibly pursuing academia someday, I'm glad I chose Michigan. There are certain professors I've had who have been extremely influential in helping shape my interests, and if I hadn't met them, I don't know exactly what shape my interests would have taken.

Isn't Michigan good for getting into academia? How does it compare to Penn as far as pursuing academia later?

[Alexandria]

Hey did any of you choose Michigan over Chicago?

I mean... only in the sense that I didn't even apply to Chicago, and there's a decent chance I would have gotten in. It was just totally unappealing to me. For one thing, I didn't want to be in a big city for law school (mostly bc of cost of living). Second, the law and econ approach Chicago is known for sounded very unappealing to me (and now that I've had some exposure to it, I know I was right). Third, it simply doesn't have a reputation for having happy, friendly students.

That said, I know a couple people who went there, and they seem happy enough with their choice. That's the problem with picking a school... aside from transfers, no one you talk to has the experience of going both places.

Even now that I have some ideas of possibly pursuing academia someday, I'm glad I chose Michigan. There are certain professors I've had who have been extremely influential in helping shape my interests, and if I hadn't met them, I don't know exactly what shape my interests would have taken.

Isn't Michigan good for getting into academia? How does it compare to Penn as far as pursuing academia later?

Michigan and Penn are probably roughly equal in this regard, with Michigan perhaps slightly stronger.

These look at it in different ways:
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2009 ... hing.shtml
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2008 ... hing.shtml
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2006 ... hing.shtml

[Veyron]

Sixigan?

[Jeff Mangum]

Just another factor to consider w/r/t Lawyer's Club: it's quite expensive compared with what you can get on the market, in my experience. I got a large 1 br in a good, well maintained building in a nice part of town (near the condo tower) close to campus, furnished, laundry included, for about $300 less than the LC--and I was picky. I easily could have gotten a less nice/cheaper apt close to the quad and saved twice as much. I know, the food and utilities are included at the LC, but still, it's something to consider, depending on your habits; I'd have assumed the opposite prior to looking into my choices.

[Aeroplane]

Isn't Michigan good for getting into academia? How does it compare to Penn as far as pursuing academia later?

Michigan and Penn are probably roughly equal in this regard, with Michigan perhaps slightly stronger.

These look at it in different ways:
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2009 ... hing.shtml
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2008 ... hing.shtml
http://www.leiterrankings.com/jobs/2006 ... hing.shtml

I'm going to outright troll for Michigan here: the most relevant metrics are the ones for recent tenure-track hires (second report), and Solum's figures for 2007-9 show a big advantage to Michigan. Adjusting for class size makes the difference smaller than the absolute figures below indicate, but not by nearly enough to make them equal (~250 at Penn v. ~350 at UM).

2009 Michigan: 11
2009 Penn: 2

2008 Michigan: 9
2008 Penn: 1

2007 Michigan: 6
2007 Penn: 3

FWIW: I had the option of going to Penn & chose Michigan.

Edit to add: --LinkRemoved--

[tallboone]

How strong do you feel the alumni network is? Would you say it's comparable to any other large public school or more similar to an elite private university? For example, being from the LA area, everyone instinctively knows how USC has an advantage over UCLA in networking even though UCLA is the better school.