Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

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Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Sun Jun 02, 2019 4:33 pm

Junior associate trying to lateral in this market. Wondering based on your/your friends' experience whether any CapM group in NYC stands out as being a good spot/horrific spot culturally/quality of work wise. Would appreciate any insight!

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 03, 2019 12:13 am

NYC Cap Markets associate here. Top groups include (in no particular order): Skadden, DPW, STB, Latham, Cahill, Milbank, S&C. Each of these firms has a different mix of underwriter/issuer and debt/equity work. Can’t speak to culture at all of these, but can say the practice is generally less brutal than m&a.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:38 am

What about Kirkland?

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 03, 2019 11:51 am

Cleary has a top-notch cap markets practice and is generally regarded as a more "friendly" firm.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:30 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Cleary has a top-notch cap markets practice and is generally regarded as a more "friendly" firm.


Curious as to what “friendly” means. Friendly to associates?

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby QContinuum » Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Cleary has a top-notch cap markets practice and is generally regarded as a more "friendly" firm.


Curious as to what “friendly” means. Friendly to associates?

Friendly in terms of culture, like you're more likely to receive "honest feedback" as opposed to "brutally honest feedback."

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Wild Card » Wed Jun 05, 2019 2:37 am

Look at the full-year league tables published by Bloomberg or Thomson Reuters.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 05, 2019 7:54 am

Anonymous User wrote:What about Kirkland?


OP here. I have to imagine that KE's restructuring group/M&A group create a lot of workstream for their CapM group. And my experience of doing similar work at my firm is that those are pretty intense fire drills.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby LaLiLuLeLo » Sun Jun 09, 2019 6:14 pm

Kinda depends what you want. I’m pretty sure Cahill is almost exclusively underwriters counsel for debt deals, for example.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:58 am

3rd year DPW associate here. We are often ranked top or within the top 3 of various cap market league tables. We are also often told by the partners we are the best in the country/world (which may be true, but also may just be a bunch of BS). I would say I do notice a difference in quality of work from a senior DPW associate to some of the work I see come across from other firms, but that could just be bias.

Generally, the associates are fairly nice here, but the group has been bleeding mid-levels and seniors for the last year and people tend to get crushed. DPW has a tendency to tell a client they can get anything done in any time frame, so it's not unusual for your nights and weekends to get screwed by an unreasonable request.

Lots of UW work (though I've actually done a fair amount of issuer-side too, but I think I'm a bit of an outlier), so a lot of the exit opportunities seem to be on the financial institutions side. Not to say you can't find other gigs through normal processes, but if you're relying solely on networking, that's going to be where most of the jobs are at.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 10, 2019 1:47 pm

Is it fairly common to jump between these firms? I.e. what are good lateral options for a Cahill associate? I mostly do lender side debt capital markets work, whether that's a HY bond issuance or a credit agreement. Mostly looking to go to a firm that doesn't do commitment papers (aka weekend killers).

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Mon Jun 10, 2019 5:56 pm

Are commitment papers as painful for the borrower side as much as they are for the lender side?

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:13 pm

I work at Cahill, with the caveat that I do lit with friends in cap markets which is almost the entire corp practice. From what I understand Cahill is the dominant force in high yield/Lev fin UW work and any firm looking for someone in that space will look heavily at Cahill associates. But apparently it also sucks substantively. Apparently Cahill has solid UW exit options but relatively tough to get company side work either in house or at another firm. My friends complain that it's a narrow practice, but that they are leaps ahead of other associates in the space for their class year because of deal flow. Their hours are beyond bad too.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:20 pm

I have practiced cap markets at a couple of top firms in NY, and Skadden would be my first choice for cap m if I was starting over. Tons of hours, but
a good mix of issuer/underwriter representations and pretty much a pure cap m practice. I can't speak to all of the top firms, but Cahill is definitely an underwriter shop, Latham has made significant strides on issuer side work but requires cap m associates to work on lender side commitment papers and Kirkland cap m is heavily PE and restructuring/liability management focused. You'll obviously be fine at any of the top firms, but if you enjoy doing cap m deal work with (generally) predictable processes then I would steer clear of Latham and Kirkland.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I have practiced cap markets at a couple of top firms in NY, and Skadden would be my first choice for cap m if I was starting over. Tons of hours, but
a good mix of issuer/underwriter representations and pretty much a pure cap m practice. I can't speak to all of the top firms, but Cahill is definitely an underwriter shop, Latham has made significant strides on issuer side work but requires cap m associates to work on lender side commitment papers and Kirkland cap m is heavily PE and restructuring/liability management focused. You'll obviously be fine at any of the top firms, but if you enjoy doing cap m deal work with (generally) predictable processes then I would steer clear of Latham and Kirkland.


Anecdotal as well coming from me, but I think of Latham as having a fairly broad cap markets practice, and really being the one firm that crosses over and does both the "traditional Wall Street" work and the biotech equity deals. Haven't heard that associates get pulled in to commitment papers.

In that first bucket of "traditional" work, I think of Latham, DPW, Skadden, Simpson, S&C, Cahill. In the other bucket, that's working on all of the biotech IPOs, every deal seems to be Latham, Goodwin, Cooley, Ropes or Wilmer.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:26 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Anecdotal as well coming from me, but I think of Latham as having a fairly broad cap markets practice, and really being the one firm that crosses over and does both the "traditional Wall Street" work and the biotech equity deals. Haven't heard that associates get pulled in to commitment papers.


I'm the anonymous poster from above that mentioned Latham and commitment papers. Can 100% confirm this is true - associates in cap m get roped into the bond piece of commitment papers pretty regularly (depending on the market) and are often responsible for running the "diligence tree". Unless someone is slow they just throw associates onto trees, when they start hoping their bank loses quickly. As you noted, the regular deal work at Latham is pretty good, but when coupled with commitment papers life can be pretty unbearable. Obviously banking attorneys have a similar existence, but at least they signed up for it. At LW associates generally don't work on them until they have reached the point of no return by opting in to cap m.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Are commitment papers as painful for the borrower side as much as they are for the lender side?


Substantively, worse. I work at a top debt firm doing primarily borrower side and we send out commitment papers to like 15 banks and then have to grid each of their responses to what I think is the most dull and esoteric stuff in transactional. But we’re the ones who send them to lenders on Fridays and kill their weekends.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:33 pm

So...that means you get to work on them during the week? That's pretty nice considering, the lender side is often working during the week...and this is just the cherry on top

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Tue Jun 11, 2019 4:49 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Are commitment papers as painful for the borrower side as much as they are for the lender side?


Substantively, worse. I work at a top debt firm doing primarily borrower side and we send out commitment papers to like 15 banks and then have to grid each of their responses to what I think is the most dull and esoteric stuff in transactional. But we’re the ones who send them to lenders on Fridays and kill their weekends.


Jesus this does sound worse, despite better timing. UGH so looks like Skadden > Cahill+Latham if wanting to get out of commitment papers. Some people at my firm have jumped to like ropes and gray or goodwin and I might consider the same if better hours. As someone mentioned above, get absolutely crushed hours wise at places like Cahill but in return for solid, but narrow, experience.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:11 pm

Can anyone else in Capital Markets/Banking-Finance weigh in on this topic?

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 12, 2019 3:39 pm

IME DPW is seen as the gold standard of gold standards for bank-side work. I'd maybe sooner go elsewhere in order to keep doing a fair bit of issuer-side work. Skadden has a good blend as another poster above mentioned. But if someone just asked me "what's the best cap markets firm in the world?" I'd probably just say DPW --- and at my V10, I think most of the cap markets partners would begrudgingly agree if pressed on it.

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Re: Good Cap Markets Groups in NYC?

Postby Anonymous User » Wed Jun 12, 2019 6:32 pm

Work at an Asia office at one of the firms mentioned above doing mostly IPO work, both issuer and UW side. Our US teams don’t do much IPO work so if I want to move back to the states at some point, should I switch firms...? Curious how marketable my experiences so far would be.



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