Akin/Paul Weiss Restructuring Forum

[Anonymous User]

What about Kramer Levin? Also, are the top creditor ships (DPW, Milbank) all that different from Kirkland/Weil in terms of quality of life ?

[Anonymous User]

Kramer is solid, but they mostly do Committee work. Never tried it, but seems like the worst gig to me, and wouldn't think it is great for exits.

[Anonymous User]

Curious about WLRK. I mean it's WLRK, so it's small, the people are smart, they work a lot, get paid a lot, but what sort of creditor work do they do, what are peoples' experiences, etc

[Anonymous User]

W&C is usually creditor side, frequently representing terrorists or otherwise acting like one, and generally disliked.

Also, to the above poster re: Skadden, my experience has also been exclusively with their Chicago office. Never worked with their NYC office, actually.

Is the work that they do bad or is the group disliked just because of the demeanor of the group's attorneys?

[Anonymous User]

They typically represent unsecured creditors, who necessarily have to take more aggressive positions if they’d like their claims to be repaid (they’re lower down in the capital structure). The personality of the group reflects the posture of their clients (Thomas Lauria is the head of their group and is known for being pretty aggressive)

[Anonymous User]

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[beeoBoop]

W&C has certain partners that are reviled in the restructuring community. It's a function of them representing out of money creditors and doing everything they can to get some cents. So its the nature of the role, but said partners also have no qualms lying to judges (and have relationships with judges so they get away with it). Good for clients I'm sure, but personally would not want to be an underlying in that environment.

This is *very* relevant to me. Can you shoot me a PM for more info?

[Anonymous User]

Curious about WLRK. I mean it's WLRK, so it's small, the people are smart, they work a lot, get paid a lot, but what sort of creditor work do they do, what are peoples' experiences, etc

I don't work at WLRK but we have attorneys who came over from there and i've worked with/across from them. They don't have a traditional bankruptcy practice a la guiding a company through an in-court reorganization. Better to think of them as a special forces finance/securities group. Unlike their peer firms, they don't draw a line between lev fin (e.g., term loans) and securities. They're holistic debt lawyers.

Earlier in their history they used to represent the more usual secured lenders (one of their former partners is why the carve-out is a thing, apparently refused to pay for debtor professionals on a case) but their practice has evolved to become more niche (as traditional bank clients have become more fee sensitive and less creative/opportunistic). See them more often representing opportunistic creditors in complicated capital structures/unique situations. Sometimes see them as co-debtor counsel as special advisors. I've had situations where we represent an ad hoc creditor group but one of the members insists on retaining WLRK for themselves on the side.

[Anonymous User]

Curious about WLRK. I mean it's WLRK, so it's small, the people are smart, they work a lot, get paid a lot, but what sort of creditor work do they do, what are peoples' experiences, etc

I don't work at WLRK but we have attorneys who came over from there and i've worked with/across from them. They don't have a traditional bankruptcy practice a la guiding a company through an in-court reorganization. Better to think of them as a special forces finance/securities group. Unlike their peer firms, they don't draw a line between lev fin (e.g., term loans) and securities. They're holistic debt lawyers.

Earlier in their history they used to represent the more usual secured lenders (one of their former partners is why the carve-out is a thing, apparently refused to pay for debtor professionals on a case) but their practice has evolved to become more niche (as traditional bank clients have become more fee sensitive and less creative/opportunistic). See them more often representing opportunistic creditors in complicated capital structures/unique situations. Sometimes see them as co-debtor counsel as special advisors. I've had situations where we represent an ad hoc creditor group but one of the members insists on retaining WLRK for themselves on the side.

Thanks a bunch, super helpful

[Anonymous User]

Is Willkie considered a bigger player in BK? Don’t seem to see them often.

[Anonymous User]

Bump

[Anonymous User]

Is Willkie considered a bigger player in BK? Don’t seem to see them often.

Willkie has appeared on a few of my matters but not often enough to see a pattern. I've seen them rep everything from sponsors to revolving lenders, to bondholders. Never seen them rep the debtor

[Anonymous User]

Is Willkie considered a bigger player in BK? Don’t seem to see them often.

Willkie has appeared on a few of my matters but not often enough to see a pattern. I've seen them rep everything from sponsors to revolving lenders, to bondholders. Never seen them rep the debtor

They do a bit of middle market debtor work, for instance they're repping Aegerion Pharm which filed yesterday, but that's about it on the debtor side.

[Anonymous User]

What is it about Committee work that people don’t like? I’ve never tried it, but doesn’t necessarily seem any worse than debtor work to me.

[Anonymous User]

What is it about Committee work that people don’t like? I’ve never tried it, but doesn’t necessarily seem any worse than debtor work to me.

Debtor-side mid level at one of the big shops.

For one, your "client" is the Committee, which is acting on behalf of all general unsecured creditors that likely aren't represented by a larger ad hoc group that's probably been negotiating with the debtors for some time and has likely negotiated a pretty substantial recovery, so, if a UCC has been appointed, it means GUCs probably aren't getting paid out in full, and you're likely throwing bombs to try to get a few more cents--that means filing objections to everything (e.g., KEIPs), filing standing motions to try to unwind certain transactions, arguing sub-con, etc... Once the Committee reaches a deal on the treatment of GUCs, the Committee essentially has a very limited role, so there could be a flurry of activity early on as you try to get up to speed on the case to negotiated, but after that, Committee work drops off a cliff.

Second, you are only negotiating on behalf of GUCs, so you don't get the broad experience that you would as a debtor-side attorney, and the GUCs won't be the future owners of the Company, so they're not involved in the more substantive governance/capitalization decisions.

[Anonymous User]

Can anyone weigh in on Stroock?

[Anonymous User]

How easy is it to hit hours, assuming there is a requirement, at the big creditor firms (DPW, Akin, PW, Kramer, Milbank etc.)?

[Anonymous User]

How easy is it to hit hours, assuming there is a requirement, at the big creditor firms (DPW, Akin, PW, Kramer, Milbank etc.)?

No requirement at PW and DPW. It's a cyclical practice so i think people understand that hours will ebb and flow

[Anonymous User]

You'll probably make your bonus at Akin but firm recently went from 1950 to blackbox hours target (and likely moving the unofficial target up soon - the firm is cheap in a bad way wrt associate comp, know plenty of people who were promised one thing and got another wrt bonuses).

[Anonymous User]

Thoughts on Milbank / Cleary in bk?

[Anonymous User]

Thoughts on Milbank / Cleary in bk?

Milbank - Traditionally strong, particularly on the creditor side, but group is trending downwards in recent years.

Cleary - Nonexistent for the most part. Believe they do a lot of sovereign debt type work but I’ve never seen them in a chapter 11.

[Anonymous User]

Thoughts on Milbank / Cleary in bk?

Milbank - Traditionally strong, particularly on the creditor side, but group is trending downwards in recent years.

Surprised to hear that about Milbank, always thought they were one of the stronger creditor groups. What groups are consideeed the strongest creditor side these days?

[Anonymous User]

Thoughts on Milbank / Cleary in bk?

Milbank - Traditionally strong, particularly on the creditor side, but group is trending downwards in recent years.

Surprised to hear that about Milbank, always thought they were one of the stronger creditor groups. What groups are consideeed the strongest creditor side these days?

Sorry didn’t mean to imply Milbank isn’t good, it is, but the partnership is aging out and not being replaced. That said, I would still put it in the top tier creditor firms with Akin, DPW, JD, probably some others.

[Anonymous User]

Thoughts on Milbank / Cleary in bk?

Milbank - Traditionally strong, particularly on the creditor side, but group is trending downwards in recent years.

Cleary - Nonexistent for the most part. Believe they do a lot of sovereign debt type work but I’ve never seen them in a chapter 11.

Cleary is pretty involved in Sears and i've seen them here and there...usually in LatAm or other sovereign debt stuff. I wouldn't call them a major player in the workout/ch. 11 space. I still don't really know what Cleary as a whole "does"...feels like they organize their business around geography rather than practice groups

[Anonymous User]

A quick question sorry - but if one wants to work internationally is restructuring a no go? Would there be any chance to move to Europe/Asia one day as a restructuring lawyer? Corporate associate here being offered an internal restructuring role.