Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM Forum

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tigers2019

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Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by tigers2019 » Wed Dec 12, 2018 1:59 pm

Hello all,

I have been accepted to both Northwestern and Florida for their tax L.L.M. Programs. I am waiting to hear back from Georgetown. I am curious to what the reputation is for employers for NW and Florida programs?

I am aware that traditionally it goes NYU - GT - Florida - NW. I have little to no interest in NYU, even with its prestige, because I have no ambition to be in NYC and id much rather start in Big4 than BigLaw. GT is a great option, but it is going to be so expensive. Florida has been great traditionally, but there has been a lot of rumors about the status of the program. But it is CHEAP. NW is the lowest ranked but they are really pushing the program hard and is held in really high regard with employers in the Midwest. It is expensive, but it is closer to friends and family, and I am competitive for scholarships there.

I visited NW and the school is amazing. Staff and a Career Office exclusively for Tax LLM students. An abundance of networking events with Chicago firms. Faculty are top of their field or impressive practitioners in the Chicago area. I have not had the opportunity to visit Gainsville yet, so if anybody has perspective on their program I would be grateful.

I want to be in Midwest after graduation. I go to a tier 2, decent grades, law review, 5 JD tax classes. I want to be in Big4 for numerous reasons (I know some of you hold BigLaw in a really high regard), but I see the long term advantages of Big4 more attractive. Especially in the Midwest. I appreciate any comments. Any other prospective Tax LLM students feel free to post questions on here as well.

QContinuum

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by QContinuum » Wed Dec 12, 2018 2:22 pm

tigers2019 wrote:I have little to no interest in NYU, even with its prestige, because I have no ambition to be in NYC and id much rather start in Big4 than BigLaw.
I suggest you reevaluate your lack of interest in NYU. It's far and away the best Tax LL.M. program in the country, regardless where you want to practice. And most NYU grads start in the Big4, not BigLaw, which is challenging to get and can't be counted on even from NYU's program.

If you get into NYU, you should attend NYU.
tigers2019 wrote:GT is a great option, but it is going to be so expensive. Florida has been great traditionally, but there has been a lot of rumors about the status of the program. But it is CHEAP. NW is the lowest ranked but they are really pushing the program hard and is held in really high regard with employers in the Midwest. It is expensive, but it is closer to friends and family, and I am competitive for scholarships there.
Georgetown, while a step below NYU, is still a full step above Florida and everyone else. I'd really lean in favor of attending Georgetown over Florida.

I do think NW has dramatically closed the gap with Florida in recent years. I'd say NW with a substantial scholarship would be TCR over Florida without a scholarship, especially with a desire to practice in the Midwest. Florida primarily places in Florida.

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nealric

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by nealric » Wed Dec 12, 2018 4:57 pm

As a tax attorney, I second the above. Florida or NU might be an option if you want to practice in Florida or Illinois. Otherwise, I wouldn't even consider them. Georgetown/NYU or bust for out of staters.

As an aside, I'd also reevaluate your preference for Big4 over Biglaw. There's few circumstances where it's better to start at the former.

pingz0r

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by pingz0r » Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:27 pm

I wouldn't go to UF if you want to practice in the Midwest. Though, I think its placement of graduates is a little more expansive than what the above posters have indicated. Employers from all of the South recruit UF LLMs and many people go to work in accounting firms in NYC too. If you're worried about being limited to NYC by going to NYU, don't be. A lot of NYU people end up in NYC, but I think that's a lot of self selection. I would say unless the difference between attending Northwestern and NYU/Georgetown is like 40-50 grand, I wouldn't consider Northwestern.
Last edited by QContinuum on Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by Anonymous User » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:26 pm

I work in biglaw in Miami. Everyone I know with an LLM went to NYU. I think some of the midsize firms are full of Florida LLMs (Gunster, for example). But even in FLORIDA, they’d much prefer an NYU LLM over Florid.

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QContinuum

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by QContinuum » Wed Dec 12, 2018 6:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I work in biglaw in Miami. Everyone I know with an LLM went to NYU. I think some of the midsize firms are full of Florida LLMs (Gunster, for example). But even in FLORIDA, they’d much prefer an NYU LLM over Florid.
This is a great point: Florida won't get a Tax LL.M. into BigLaw (even in Florida). You pretty much need NYU to get BigLaw. But even at NYU, BigLaw's difficult and far from assured. Most NYU grads go to the Big4.

The secondary point - that NYU is stronger than Florida even in Florida - is also on point. No one considering a Tax LL.M. should take Florida over NYU.

tigers2019

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by tigers2019 » Wed Dec 12, 2018 9:56 pm

This is all great information. I will shoot NYU an application to see if I can get in. Follow up questions then...

1) Will the degree pay for itself in the long run? 65K tuition + 20K living?
2) Will the NYU name carry more weight than my tier 2 JD? Meaning what is the difference of job outlook with my JD and an LLM from NW, and my JD and an LLM from NYU. The examples above are good I suppose.

I appreciate the responses, please keep them coming.

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by Anonymous User » Thu Dec 13, 2018 10:26 pm

I'll chime in. I work in a Big4 M&A group in Texas. Our LLMs are about split between NYU, GT, Florida, and NU. I don't think our partners necessarily have a preference between those schools, they look more for personality than prestige. Other than that, I agree with what the above posters have said.

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by Anonymous User » Sun Dec 16, 2018 5:10 pm

UF grad here. I know fellow classmates who went on to get a tax LLM at UF. They’re doing pretty well in and outside Florida. Can’t say how better or worse it is than other schools, but it’s tax program receives a decent measure of recognition.

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QContinuum

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by QContinuum » Mon Dec 17, 2018 6:11 pm

tigers2019 wrote:This is all great information. I will shoot NYU an application to see if I can get in. Follow up questions then...

1) Will the degree pay for itself in the long run? 65K tuition + 20K living?
If you mean will you be able to afford to pay off the cost of the LL.M., yes, you should be able to do so on a Big4 salary.

If you mean will you - overall - make more money with the LL.M. vs. without, you'd have to compare it to what kinds of jobs you'd be able to land straight out of law school.

My advice: If you want to do tax work, you should get the LL.M. If you don't want to do tax work, don't get the LL.M., as you'll be miserable. Most people seem to either love tax work or hate it. If you hate it, don't force yourself into it. You'll burn out and never recoup your time/money investment in the LL.M.
tigers2019 wrote:2) Will the NYU name carry more weight than my tier 2 JD? Meaning what is the difference of job outlook with my JD and an LLM from NW, and my JD and an LLM from NYU. The examples above are good I suppose.
Your prospects for Big4 positions will definitely be better with a NYU Tax LL.M. than with your J.D. alone. Employers interviewing you for tax positions will look more to your NYU LL.M. than to your J.D. - IOW, they'll be interviewing you because you're a NYU LL.M. student, not because you're a T2 J.D. grad. The same is true for NW, though to a much lesser extent. The drop-off in prestige is no joke. It's NYU at numero uno, a significant drop to Georgetown, a huge drop to NW and Florida, and a cliff edge drop to everyone else.

NW and Florida are worth attending, but not over NYU or Georgetown, and you should only attend NW/Florida if you're interested in working in their respective geographic regions. Not saying it's impossible to land, say, NYC Big4 straight out of Florida but you don't want to have to fight to be the exception.

tigers2019

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by tigers2019 » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:10 pm

OP here. Just wanted to give a quick update. I have decided to go to NW. They gave a very nice scholarship. Also, I have lined up a few options in BIG4 upon graduation already. This thread was very helpful in the process, if anybody out there has any questions about choosing an LLM post below. Thank you all for the insight and advice.

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Re: Northwestern v. Florida Tax LLM

Post by RedPurpleBlue » Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:25 pm

tigers2019 wrote:OP here. Just wanted to give a quick update. I have decided to go to NW. They gave a very nice scholarship. Also, I have lined up a few options in BIG4 upon graduation already. This thread was very helpful in the process, if anybody out there has any questions about choosing an LLM post below. Thank you all for the insight and advice.
Congrats on the acceptance and I hope Northwestern serves you well!

That being said, when you get to (N)orthwestern (U)niversity, you should consider changing your acronym to the correct one, NU.

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