Top Law Schools

Class of 2016 -- t-10, top 1/3, two years at V-15, current district court clerk.

Q is self-explanatory: I've heard terrible things ... but that BONEUS

Wherever you go, you'll bust your ass for at least 2000 hours ( which means working more than that) so that you can bring in over a million in revenue, of which the partners and overhead will take well over three quarters.

That's the business. It's an extremely simple business model and there's no need to overthink it.

if you got an offer from Quinn be grateful that you're at a high profit firm that has no trouble selling work.

if you don't want to go there turn down your offer as soon as possible so someone else can take it.

I understand the model fine -- I've already done two years -- but cultural climates vary greatly among shops and that's ultimately how you survive (even within groups, tbh) but some shops are just objectively shitty, regardless of hours.

I've only heard the standard rep stuff that you already knew like longer hours and more money. More of a self starter firm so not as much handholding, which you don't need since you have experience. Supposedly more time in court. supposedly more stressful responsibility early on.

You know how it'll be you'll have to give them your life.

It’s not as bad as Quinn NY

If you get a quinn LA offer, it’s definitely worth considering, and accepting if your other options are weak. I wouldn’t take it if you can get Gibson, munger, Boies, irell, HH, ect., even with the flashy bonus

Anonymous User wrote:Wherever you go, you'll bust your ass for at least 2000 hours ( which means working more than that) so that you can bring in over a million in revenue, of which the partners and overhead will take well over three quarters.

That's the business. It's an extremely simple business model and there's no need to overthink it.

if you got an offer from Quinn be grateful that you're at a high profit firm that has no trouble selling work.

if you don't want to go there turn down your offer as soon as possible so someone else can take it.

This comment is unhelpful.

Quinn is terrible for some people but could be amazing for others. Hard to know unless you try or know your own personality.

Yes Quinn LA is that bad. This thread is way to positive on what from all accounts is a terrible place to work. From everyone I've ever spoken to, including Quinn associates, it is a big step above the average biglaw awfulness. John Quinn/the firm are notoriously cheap. They skimp out on amenities/benefits at a level that just isn't seen at other large law firms. Somewhat dated, but when I visited the Quinn LA office for an interview, the place seemed like a very unenjoyable place to work. The office itself gave off a very cheap vibe and everyone just seemed so cold.

Billing 2500-3000 hours a year is something that very realistically could be in your future. Outside of the clerkship bonus, Quinn doesn't beat the market for compensation. They will give you a slight bump in bonus (few thousand $s) if you bill over 2400/year and will actually give you a below market bonus if you bill below 2100/year. Anecdotal, but billing 2000/year is much rarer than 2500+.

Ultimately, I think that the biggest thing going against Quinn is that it expects you to work elite boutique hours without actually giving you boutique level experience. At least at a lit boutique, you're getting valuable substantive experience early on, taking depositions, writing MSJs, etc., while you're billing your 2800 hours a year. Instead, nowadays at Quinn your working more hours doing the same doc review and research assignments as every other junior biglaw litigator.

I think once upon a time, Quinn truly did give associates unique practical experiences. However, that time has passed, and Quinn is largely indistinguishable from litigation at most other biglaw firms, except that you will work more hours in a more cutthroat environment. Just look through TLS, people have been ragging on Quinn for years. Their shenanigans have even made there way onto Above the Law,

https://abovethelaw.com/2017/12/as-usua ... h-it/?rf=1

https://abovethelaw.com/2012/04/how-man ... busy/?rf=1

Anonymous User wrote:Yes Quinn LA is that bad. This thread is way to positive on what from all accounts is a terrible place to work. From everyone I've ever spoken to, including Quinn associates, it is a big step above the average biglaw awfulness. John Quinn/the firm are notoriously cheap. They skimp out on amenities/benefits at a level that just isn't seen at other large law firms. Somewhat dated, but when I visited the Quinn LA office for an interview, the place seemed like a very unenjoyable place to work. The office itself gave off a very cheap vibe and everyone just seemed so cold.

Billing 2500-3000 hours a year is something that very realistically could be in your future. Outside of the clerkship bonus, Quinn doesn't beat the market for compensation. They will give you a slight bump in bonus (few thousand $s) if you bill over 2400/year and will actually give you a below market bonus if you bill below 2100/year. Anecdotal, but billing 2000/year is much rarer than 2500+.

Ultimately, I think that the biggest thing going against Quinn is that it expects you to work elite boutique hours without actually giving you boutique level experience. At least at a lit boutique, you're getting valuable substantive experience early on, taking depositions, writing MSJs, etc., while you're billing your 2800 hours a year. Instead, nowadays at Quinn your working more hours doing the same doc review and research assignments as every other junior biglaw litigator.

I think once upon a time, Quinn truly did give associates unique practical experiences. However, that time has passed, and Quinn is largely indistinguishable from litigation at most other biglaw firms, except that you will work more hours in a more cutthroat environment. Just look through TLS, people have been ragging on Quinn for years. Their shenanigans have even made there way onto Above the Law,

https://abovethelaw.com/2017/12/as-usua ... h-it/?rf=1

https://abovethelaw.com/2012/04/how-man ... busy/?rf=1

Quinn is fucking terrible. Let’s not pretend Paul, Weiss or whatever is better for a fucking second. I’m no Quinn chearleader; but I’ve worked at other “top litigation shops” and I will easily take your top tragic quinn story against my W&C/MTO/BSF/whatever tale of doom. Big law is bad. Quinn sucks, even among the bad. Is it worth another $55k to suffer through? I mean, maybe. Depends on circumstance.

OP, be very careful getting advice on the truly top-tier firms from a site like top law schools. There is a bias on this site against the truly elite firms. They'll attack Quinn, WLRK, Cravath . . . A certain kind of person posts here and it might not be your crowd.

Do Quinn, WLRK, Cravath and the other super-elites work their people hard? Duh, everyone already knew that. But the benefit is that you don't have to worry about not having enough work to do, and getting laid off. Another benefit is that you see how things work at the truly elite.

I'm not saying you should go to Quinn, but don't give TLS too much weight.

Anonymous User wrote:OP, be very careful getting advice on the truly top-tier firms from a site like top law schools. There is a bias on this site against the truly elite firms. They'll attack Quinn, WLRK, Cravath . . . A certain kind of person posts here and it might not be your crowd.

Do Quinn, WLRK, Cravath and the other super-elites work their people hard? Duh, everyone already knew that. But the benefit is that you don't have to worry about not having enough work to do, and getting laid off. Another benefit is that you see how things work at the truly elite.

I'm not saying you should go to Quinn, but don't give TLS too much weight.

1) no one ever hates on WRLK because nothing is better than WLRK for transactional work (who doesn’t like a massive bonus?)

2) Quinn is not in the super-elite group (Munger and Boies are) because there are a ton of boutiques that pay more and are more elite (Susman, HH, etc.).

3) you must work at Quinn or be an 0L.

2013 wrote:

Anonymous User wrote:OP, be very careful getting advice on the truly top-tier firms from a site like top law schools. There is a bias on this site against the truly elite firms. They'll attack Quinn, WLRK, Cravath . . . A certain kind of person posts here and it might not be your crowd.

Do Quinn, WLRK, Cravath and the other super-elites work their people hard? Duh, everyone already knew that. But the benefit is that you don't have to worry about not having enough work to do, and getting laid off. Another benefit is that you see how things work at the truly elite.

I'm not saying you should go to Quinn, but don't give TLS too much weight.

1) no one ever hates on WRLK because nothing is better than WLRK for transactional work (who doesn’t like a massive bonus?)

2) Quinn is not in the super-elite group (Munger and Boies are) because there are a ton of boutiques that pay more and are more elite (Susman, HH, etc.).

3) you must work at Quinn or be an 0L.

You don't know Quinn's actual discretionary bonuses, and you wouldn't get an offer from there.

Anonymous User wrote:OP, be very careful getting advice on the truly top-tier firms from a site like top law schools. There is a bias on this site against the truly elite firms. They'll attack Quinn, WLRK, Cravath . . . A certain kind of person posts here and it might not be your crowd.

While I agree that any advice from TLS should be taken with a (large) grain of salt, I've never detected any kind of anti-WLRK bias around here. (Nor have I detected any anti-Cravath bias, for that matter.) If anything, TLS often leans a bit too in favor of WLRK, as seen in the recent threads in this forum about choosing between WLRK vs. Cravath/Deb/what have you.

[Redacted] There's a lot of negativity going on, so I'll also throw in my friend who recently accepted Quinn. They asked a lot of former Quinn people, and there were some horror stories but a lot of people who enjoyed their experience. What I've taken away from this whole process is that it takes a certain kind of person to enjoy Quinn. You have to seriously love litigation, like you went to law school with the sole purpose of doing lit, not a reason like "I liked arguing and law school seemed like an okay choice to make money." You've also got to love learning and teaching yourself because they don't do formalied training, its sink or swim. You basically need to be the kind of person who doesn't just handle stress well, but THRIVES on it.

Moderator note: Redaction made to preserve poster anonymity. -QContinuum

Anonymous User wrote:There's a lot of negativity going on, so I'll also throw in my friend who recently accepted Quinn. They asked a lot of former Quinn people, and there were some horror stories but a lot of people who enjoyed their experience. What I've taken away from this whole process is that it takes a certain kind of person to enjoy Quinn. You have to seriously love litigation, like you went to law school with the sole purpose of doing lit, not a reason like "I liked arguing and law school seemed like an okay choice to make money." You've also got to love learning and teaching yourself because they don't do formalied training, its sink or swim. You basically need to be the kind of person who doesn't just handle stress well, but THRIVES on it.

This more or less applies to all top firms in major markets. Also, law students need to stop trying to give actual lawyers advice on firm cultures.

Moderator note: Quoted post edited to redact content for anonymity. -QContinuum

Anonymous User wrote:There's a lot of negativity going on, so I'll also throw in my friend who recently accepted Quinn. They asked a lot of former Quinn people, and there were some horror stories but a lot of people who enjoyed their experience. What I've taken away from this whole process is that it takes a certain kind of person to enjoy Quinn. You have to seriously love litigation, like you went to law school with the sole purpose of doing lit, not a reason like "I liked arguing and law school seemed like an okay choice to make money." You've also got to love learning and teaching yourself because they don't do formalied training, its sink or swim. You basically need to be the kind of person who doesn't just handle stress well, but THRIVES on it.

QE associate here. This is all totally accurate.

Moderator note: Quoted post edited to redact content for anonymity. -QContinuum