NYC to 200k

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Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:12 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Losing hope for OMM...


OMM will match. I feel like OMM's rep has already lost some cache (my baby boomer FIL talks about OMM like it's Gibson Dunn or Latham). But PPP is still high even though declining. I just don't think OMM wants to resign itself to second-tier status.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:16 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Losing hope for OMM...


OMM will match. I feel like OMM's rep has already lost some cache (my baby boomer FIL talks about OMM like it's Gibson Dunn or Latham). But PPP is still high even though declining. I just don't think OMM wants to resign itself to second-tier status.


I think OMM views Latham and Gibson as peer firms, so I wouldn't be shocked if we see a match from OMM soon.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:18 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Losing hope for OMM...


OMM will match. I feel like OMM's rep has already lost some cache (my baby boomer FIL talks about OMM like it's Gibson Dunn or Latham). But PPP is still high even though declining. I just don't think OMM wants to resign itself to second-tier status.


I think OMM views Latham and Gibson as peer firms, so I wouldn't be shocked if we see a match from OMM soon.


I would be shocked to see a match from Latham soon. Where the hell are those guys?

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:20 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
This is correct.

The average associate in nyc V5 is not billing 2400 in my experience. As an associate at S&C, we are shown figures by firm management that average associate hours are around 1700-1800 (which is less than average partner billables). I personally billed 1750 as a 3rd year and got full bonus, no comment at all about hours in reviews. This is not atypical. At Skadden I would have gotten no bonus, which would have sucked.

Obviously there are people who get crushed but remember sometimes it’s your fault if you don’t step off the treadmill. Being at a no minimum firm is highly, highly preferable.


I get the feeling that reported averages include laterals, people who took time a large amount of time off (maternity leave or otherwise), people on part time arrangements, etc. Wonder if they even count stub years. I don't think they're at all representative of what a typical associate would bill over the course of 12 months.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:21 pm

they also count all the people who know they are quitting and just cruising for six months, labor associates, etc.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
This is correct.

The average associate in nyc V5 is not billing 2400 in my experience. As an associate at S&C, we are shown figures by firm management that average associate hours are around 1700-1800 (which is less than average partner billables). I personally billed 1750 as a 3rd year and got full bonus, no comment at all about hours in reviews. This is not atypical. At Skadden I would have gotten no bonus, which would have sucked.

Obviously there are people who get crushed but remember sometimes it’s your fault if you don’t step off the treadmill. Being at a no minimum firm is highly, highly preferable.


I get the feeling that reported averages include laterals, people who took time a large amount of time off (maternity leave or otherwise), people on part time arrangements, etc. Wonder if they even count stub years. I don't think they're at all representative of what a typical associate would bill over the course of 12 months.


This. All my friends at V10s work a lot. Sure they may have an easy year (like Y3 above), but average they are probably all putting in well over 2000 a year. Note how nobody here has stood up and said "I'm at a lockstep bonus no minimum hours firm and regularly billed less than 2k and had no problems with that." Speaks for itself.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mayer Brown matched raises and bonuses. you need 1900 prorated hours by the end of June and if you don't hit it now but hit it end of year, they'll include it in your year-end bonus.


What about incoming associates? Will they be on the 180 or 190 scale?


190 (summers too)

malibustacy

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby malibustacy » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:34 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mayer Brown matched raises and bonuses. you need 1900 prorated hours by the end of June and if you don't hit it now but hit it end of year, they'll include it in your year-end bonus.


What about incoming associates? Will they be on the 180 or 190 scale?


How is this a serious question? Holy shit.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:40 pm

malibustacy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mayer Brown matched raises and bonuses. you need 1900 prorated hours by the end of June and if you don't hit it now but hit it end of year, they'll include it in your year-end bonus.


What about incoming associates? Will they be on the 180 or 190 scale?


How is this a serious question? Holy shit.


I know, right? Sure, the Yale/Columbia elitists are the neurotic/read into everything types, but calm down folks.

worklifewhat

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby worklifewhat » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:42 pm

malibustacy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mayer Brown matched raises and bonuses. you need 1900 prorated hours by the end of June and if you don't hit it now but hit it end of year, they'll include it in your year-end bonus.


What about incoming associates? Will they be on the 180 or 190 scale?


How is this a serious question? Holy shit.

Perfect response.

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 2:44 pm

worklifewhat wrote:
malibustacy wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Mayer Brown matched raises and bonuses. you need 1900 prorated hours by the end of June and if you don't hit it now but hit it end of year, they'll include it in your year-end bonus.


What about incoming associates? Will they be on the 180 or 190 scale?


How is this a serious question? Holy shit.

Perfect response.


Just comes to show the declining medians at law schools.

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:03 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Skadden’s state of the firm said average associate billables (including permitted marketing / pro bono etc) were 1750. Skadden’s bonus threshold is 1800. I think people here are underestimating how many people get screwed.


The firms I have worked at both seem to have had that same thing, where the average is just below what it takes to qualify for a bonus, but most associates appear to have come in above the bonus line. I think it is just that most associates come in just over the bonus line, but then you get some extremely low ones that pull the average way down. Maybe just people who couldn't find much work, but for all I know it could also be like people out on disability, maternity/paternity leave, maybe people being dedicated to special non-billable projects, who knows. Averages are a pretty bad way to measure that kind of thing really.

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:04 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Losing hope for OMM...


OMM will match. I feel like OMM's rep has already lost some cache (my baby boomer FIL talks about OMM like it's Gibson Dunn or Latham). But PPP is still high even though declining. I just don't think OMM wants to resign itself to second-tier status.


If they don’t match today, I’ll still be hopeful...but I may also be picking up recruiter phone calls next week.

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:05 pm

Hogan to 200

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:13 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Losing hope for OMM...


OMM will match. I feel like OMM's rep has already lost some cache (my baby boomer FIL talks about OMM like it's Gibson Dunn or Latham). But PPP is still high even though declining. I just don't think OMM wants to resign itself to second-tier status.


If they don’t match today, I’ll still be hopeful...but I may also be picking up recruiter phone calls next week.


If they haven't matched by end of day Monday, I'm convinced it's not going to happen. They've certainly already made up their mind on it since it's been ~2.5 weeks since Milbank raised.

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hogan to 200


False

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:14 pm

Anonymous User wrote:Hogan to 200


Covington to 145

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:16 pm

Anonymous User wrote:If they haven't matched by end of day Monday, I'm convinced it's not going to happen. They've certainly already made up their mind on it since it's been ~2.5 weeks since Milbank raised.


Meh, I wouldn't conclude that. We are sitting here refreshing every 10 minutes to see what the latest is. Most partners I've talked to had no idea firms were even raising. They don't necessarily see it as such an urgent timeline. I would imagine a lot of firms are just like thinking "ok, let's put this on the agenda for the next compensation committee meeting in X weeks" and whatnot.

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:18 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hogan to 200


Covington to 145


Confirmed. CovingTTTon's new scale:

2017: $145k
2016: $149k
2015+: $153

$3k bonus to be paid out to associates who hit their billable hours targets each year from 2014 to 2017. To be paid out in company store credits. In October. For associates still remaining at the firm at that time.
Last edited by Anonymous User on Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Anonymous User
Posts: 327278
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:22 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hogan to 200


Covington to 145


Confirmed. CovingTTTon's new scale:

2017: $145k
2016: $149k
2015+: $153

$3k bonus to be paid out to associates who hit their billable hours targets each year from 2004 to 2017.


Just had a weird moment of self-awareness thinking about how anywhere in America, including in DC, making $145,000 a year would be a pretty impressive accomplishment. And here, the mere thought of that being the starting salary for a 27-year-old is pathetic and laughable...

. . .

. . .

Moment gone. GIVE ME MOAR MONEY.

Anonymous User
Posts: 327278
Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:25 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hogan to 200


Covington to 145


Confirmed. CovingTTTon's new scale:

2017: $145k
2016: $149k
2015+: $153

$3k bonus to be paid out to associates who hit their billable hours targets each year from 2004 to 2017.


Just had a weird moment of self-awareness thinking about how anywhere in America, including in DC, making $145,000 a year would be a pretty impressive accomplishment. And here, the mere thought of that being the starting salary for a 27-year-old is pathetic and laughable...

. . .

. . .

Moment gone. GIVE ME MOAR MONEY.


This job is far too difficult and demanding. If it didn't pay really well absolutely no one would do it. As it is a lot of people don't want to stick around.

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NakedPowerOrgan

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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby NakedPowerOrgan » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:25 pm

18 days after Milbank shocked the legal world and threw in-house counsel into fits of rage, 16 days after STB promised special 2018 summer bonuses to stanch the frothy salary exuberance and prevent a permanent rise to $200K, and 11 days after Cravath kicked in additional $5–10K raises to senior associates in order to stay relevant and keep the "Cravath Scale" brand intact, the Wall of Shame remains far too populated.

NakedPowerOrgan wrote:Wall of Shame for Firms Yet to Announce:

    Kirkland ($4.70MM PPP, 44.7% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Davis Polk ($3.70MM PPP, 50.7% L5Y PPP growth, 3.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Weil ($3.64MM PPP, 63.2% L5Y PPP growth, 3.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Paul Weiss ($4.56MM PPP, 36.2% L5Y PPP growth, 3.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Milbank ($3.46MM PPP, 41.5% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Fried Frank ($2.94MM PPP, 123.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Simpson ($3.68MM PPP, 38.2% L5Y PPP growth, 3.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Skadden ($3.47MM PPP, 32.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    SullCrom ($4.27MM PPP, 23.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Willkie ($2.97MM PPP, 43.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Akin Gump ($2.39MM PPP, 54.9% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    1. Latham ($3.25MM PPP, 33.0% L5Y PPP growth, 3.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    2. Paul Hastings ($2.91MM PPP, 39.7% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    3. Boies ($3.27MM PPP, 20.1% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    Shearman ($2.32MM PPP, 52.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.6 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Vinson & Elkins ($2.36MM PPP, 60.6% L5Y PPP growth, 3.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Quinn ($4.74MM PPP, 6.8% L5Y PPP growth, 2.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    4. King & Spalding ($2.61MM PPP, 31.2% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Cravath ($4.00MM PPP, 14.2% L5Y PPP growth, 4.3 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Gibson Dunn ($3.24MM PPP, 15.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Schulte ($2.56MM PPP, 21.6% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    5. WilmerHale ($2.12MM PPP, 44.9% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Ropes ($2.32MM PPP, 46.1% L5Y PPP growth, 3.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Dechert ($2.68MM PPP, 27.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Goodwin ($2.15MM PPP, 42.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.3 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Proskauer ($2.37MM PPP, 27.9% L5Y PPP growth, 2.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Cahill ($3.69MM PPP, 3.9% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Cooley ($2.08MM PPP, 39.4% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Winston ($2.16MM PPP, 44.8% L5Y PPP growth, 3.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    6. Baker Botts ($1.84MM PPP, 35.1% L5Y PPP growth, 1.9 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Cleary ($3.07MM PPP, 17.3% L5Y PPP growth, 3.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Debevoise ($2.83MM PPP, 36.2% L5Y PPP growth, 5.3 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Sidley ($2.26MM PPP, 25.6% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Wilson Sonsini ($2.21MM PPP, 34.4% L5Y PPP growth, 3.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    7. Alston & Bird ($1.93MM PPP, 12.3% L5Y PPP growth, 1.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    White & Case ($2.26MM PPP, 32.9% L5Y PPP growth, 3.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Kramer Levin ($2.15MM PPP, 28.5% L5Y PPP growth, 3.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    8. Sheppard ($1.71MM PPP, 35.2% L5Y PPP growth, 2.4 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    9. Cadwalader ($2.51MM PPP, -5.3% L5Y PPP growth, 4.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    Mayer Brown ($1.58MM PPP, 37.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    10. Holland & Knight ($1.36MM PPP, 43.2% L5Y PPP growth, 2.1 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    11. McDermott ($1.71MM PPP, 17.3% L5Y PPP growth, 1.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    12. Katten ($1.57MM PPP, 19.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    13. Fragomen ($1.98MM PPP, 31.4% L5Y PPP growth, 4.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    14. Covington ($1.54MM PPP, 22.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.0 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    14. Greenberg ($1.63MM PPP, 20.1% L5Y PPP growth, 2.2 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    16. Fish & Richardson ($1.63MM PPP, 9.8% L5Y PPP growth, 1.5 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    16. MoFo ($1.74MM PPP, 18.1% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    18. O'Melveny ($2.01MM PPP, -2.5% L5Y PPP growth, 3.3 EP:Assoc. leverage)


    Orrick ($1.86MM PPP, 14.3% L5Y PPP growth, 3.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Fenwick ($1.51MM PPP, 31.0% L5Y PPP growth, 2.8 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    19. Jenner ($1.42MM PPP, -4.9% L5Y PPP growth, 1.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)

    Baker McKenzie ($1.30MM PPP, 19.3% L5Y PPP growth, 2.7 EP:Assoc. leverage)
    Morgan Lewis ($1.37MM PPP, -11.7% L5Y PPP growth, 1.3 EP:Assoc. leverage)


Legend:
New York
California
Washington, D.C.
Chicago
Houston
Boston
Atlanta
Philadelphia
Florida

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:28 pm

Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:
Anonymous User wrote:Hogan to 200


Covington to 145


Confirmed. CovingTTTon's new scale:

2017: $145k
2016: $149k
2015+: $153

$3k bonus to be paid out to associates who hit their billable hours targets each year from 2014 to 2017. To be paid out in company store credits. In October. For associates still remaining at the firm at that time.


I got 16 tons...

Anonymous User
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Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:37 pm

I'm getting so sick of waiting.

Anonymous User
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Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 9:32 am

Re: NYC to 200k

Postby Anonymous User » Fri Jun 22, 2018 3:41 pm

Anonymous User wrote:I'm getting so sick of waiting.

Lateral



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