2017 PLIP Forum

[Anonymous User]

Hi Everyone, I'm in a bit of a conundrum and would like some advice. In an effort to get face time with my top choice firm, I bid on all the offices they had available which also fit my area of expertise. Importantly-- this is not a firm that varies in GPA requirement dramatically from office of office... it appears they all have the same requirement but perhaps differ in popularity.

Out of those 5 or so bids, there were two I was *really* hoping for. Well, I did get preselected for the firm... but for my last choice office, and nothing else. In my interview, do I mention I would really like to work at another office? Do I mail the office I want individually? Do I bid on my preferred office at my law school's OCI?

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have any movement with alternates? I'm wondering if they haven't updated it yet or if I just didn't have any of my alts convert

[Carlton_Banks]

Anyone have any movement with alternates? I'm wondering if they haven't updated it yet or if I just didn't have any of my alts convert

Had one convert last night. Nothing since then.

[Anonymous User]

Anyone have any movement with alternates? I'm wondering if they haven't updated it yet or if I just didn't have any of my alts convert

Also had one convert to an interview.

[PotatoSalad]

Anyone have any movement with alternates? I'm wondering if they haven't updated it yet or if I just didn't have any of my alts convert

I also got pulled off an alternates list for an interview (surprised someone cancelled on this firm, but pleased).

Note it does not update on the "Employers/Bidding" section at all, only the "Scheduled Interviews" section. Additionally, the ranking doesn't appear to alter based on any cancellations: I'm still listed as "Alternate(X)" on the "Employers/Bidding" section.

[Anonymous User]

Did everyone who got a preselect from Sidley get asked to fill out a diversity form??! ~*Reading the tea leaves**~*

[Anonymous User]

Did everyone who got a preselect from Sidley get asked to fill out a diversity form??! ~*Reading the tea leaves**~*

I did not get preselected or an alternate spot for Sidley (but bid them) and still got this so I wouldn't read too much into it.

[PotatoSalad]

Did everyone who got a preselect from Sidley get asked to fill out a diversity form??! ~*Reading the tea leaves**~*

I was preselected by Sidley New York and did not receive a request for a diversity form. Not sure what that tells you.

[Anonymous User]

Who got an invite to go bowling with Finnegan?

[Anonymous User]

Who got an invite to go bowling with Finnegan?

Yup, I wonder if other firms do this and I should wait to see if other invites come through.

That said I heard Finnegan's bowling night is fun, and was recommended it by a past PLIP attendee.

[UVA2B]

Who got an invite to go bowling with Finnegan?

Yup, I wonder if other firms do this and I should wait to see if other invites come through.

That said I heard Finnegan's bowling night is fun, and was recommended it by a past PLIP attendee.

Any chance to interact with the firm is a positive to me. Although hopefully rolling strikes is preferred and not required.

[Anonymous User]

Re: Finnegan bowling

I've heard Finnegan has been slow for some time. A number of partner departures between 2012-2014 really hurt the firm. A lot of the experienced IP associates forecast some doom over there.

[Anonymous User]

Re: Finnegan bowling

I've heard Finnegan has been slow for some time. A number of partner departures between 2012-2014 really hurt the firm. A lot of the experienced IP associates forecast some doom over there.

Finnegan PPP is up ~1% from 2012 from 1,160,000 to 1,175,000 at a time where Winston & Strawn (the destination of the ITC team in 2013) is up ~20% from 1,460,000 to 1,750,000 over the same period.

I spoke with one of the partners at W&S who had left Finnegan and he said he left for financial issues, looking to seek a firm that held no debt. I don't know the validity of that statement (or if it was just a front and W&S gave them a sweet deal). But take it FWIW.

EDIT: The W&S partner also said to me "at Finnegan, there was a company tab that Partners could use to take Associates out for drinks every week. Here at Winston, if a partner wants to do that it comes out of his own tab." Which I thought was a very odd thing to say to a student interested in joining the firm, but I took it as candid honesty.

[Anonymous User]

Re: Finnegan bowling

I've heard Finnegan has been slow for some time. A number of partner departures between 2012-2014 really hurt the firm. A lot of the experienced IP associates forecast some doom over there.

Finnegan PPP is up ~1% from 2012 from 1,160,000 to 1,175,000 at a time where Winston & Strawn (the destination of the ITC team in 2013) is up ~20% from 1,460,000 to 1,750,000 over the same period.

I spoke with one of the partners at W&S who had left Finnegan and he said he left for financial issues, looking to seek a firm that held no debt. I don't know the validity of that statement (or if it was just a front and W&S gave them a sweet deal). But take it FWIW.

EDIT: The W&S partner also said to me "at Finnegan, there was a company tab that Partners could use to take Associates out for drinks every week. Here at Winston, if a partner wants to do that it comes out of his own tab." Which I thought was a very odd thing to say to a student interested in joining the firm, but I took it as candid honesty.

I'm the quoted anon. I'm actually familiar with that ITC group and have a great impression of them. When they left, ATL did an article about how it was the loss of major rainmakers. They are not the only Finnegan departures from recent years I had in mind. I can think of three relatively new boutiques off the top of my head (Bookoff McAndrews is one, Kelly IP is another) which was formed by departed Finnegan attorneys.

I've known more than one Finnegan associate over the years, and I know many IP associates. I keep hearing tales of doom.

[PotatoSalad]

.

[qmc]

Couple questions about PLIP:

1. How important are "ties" to the market? Was thinking less important since these IP jobs are not as common. Is this the correct assumption, or do others believe differently? If they are just as important, any suggestions on how to justify pursuing a job in a market you have no ties to?

2. How are these interviews structured? Obviously different than your run of the mill OCI interview, but what questions seem to be common at PLIP, or in any other IP interview for that matter? Also, if one does not have much IP related experience (i.e. went straight through), how do you respond to questions where you are lacking experience without ruining your chances?

Any advice, experience, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

[PotatoSalad]

Couple questions about PLIP:

1. How important are "ties" to the market? Was thinking less important since these IP jobs are not as common. Is this the correct assumption, or do others believe differently? If they are just as important, any suggestions on how to justify pursuing a job in a market you have no ties to?

2. How are these interviews structured? Obviously different than your run of the mill OCI interview, but what questions seem to be common at PLIP, or in any other IP interview for that matter? Also, if one does not have much IP related experience (i.e. went straight through), how do you respond to questions where you are lacking experience without ruining your chances?

Any advice, experience, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

Ties are still important. But the firms have already preselected you so they're giving you the time of day - it's perhaps not as uphill of a battle as it might be at regular OCI. I'd say just prepare an answer for the inevitable question "Why do you want to work in X?"

From what I've heard, interviews are a little more tailored to the IP setting. Firms who have both will want to know: litigation or prosecution? Have an answer prepared for each firm, know their business model and what they do in that office. And actually look, just because a boutique's website may say they do litigation, it may only be one or two partners and they're generally looking for prosecutors. Same for general practice firms, know if their office actually does prosecution (and if so, what industries), or just litigation. At the end of the day they're still going to be looking for fit out of the interview much like an OCI interview. Know the interviewer, know the firm, prepare questions.

On another note: Is anyone flying into Chicago O'Hare the morning of August 2nd who might want to split an Uber? They normally run ~$50 to downtown and I'm not about that life if I can help it. PM me if interested.

[RaceJudicata]

On another note: Is anyone flying into Chicago O'Hare the morning of August 2nd who might want to split an Uber? They normally run ~$50 to downtown and I'm not about that life if I can help it. PM me if interested.

Dude, don't bother trying to uber on the Kennedy in the am. Take the blue line. Will probably a shorter trip downtown... and costs $2.50 or whatever.

[Bluem_11]

Couple questions about PLIP:

1. How important are "ties" to the market? Was thinking less important since these IP jobs are not as common. Is this the correct assumption, or do others believe differently? If they are just as important, any suggestions on how to justify pursuing a job in a market you have no ties to?

2. How are these interviews structured? Obviously different than your run of the mill OCI interview, but what questions seem to be common at PLIP, or in any other IP interview for that matter? Also, if one does not have much IP related experience (i.e. went straight through), how do you respond to questions where you are lacking experience without ruining your chances?

Any advice, experience, etc. would be greatly appreciated.

1. They are important still depending on market. NYC/CHI/DC, not really, Grand Rapids, Nashville and Milwaukee, important. That being said, you have a little more leverage than non-IP folks especially if you're in a desirable patent pros field. That doesn't mean you have all the leverage, just relatively more. For patent pros, the training takes 1-2 years, so they don't want to see you run.

2. Some of them have their question prepped ahead of time, some will be tailored to your resume. Regardless, you have a short amount of time to sell them. Common ?'s have to do with your scientific background/knowledge, why IP instead of your undergrad field, and any practical experience/classes you may have taken. Of course I had plenty out of left field. I had some ask me about the local sports teams in the area I had little knowledge of. I had one ask me for what types of inventions I want to work with the most. Be understanding of the interviewer, in PLIP things can get hectic, and if they fall 3 minutes behind on one interview things can stagger on them. If you have no experience, sell your scientific knowledge for pros, or law school skills for lit.

[PotatoSalad]

On another note: Is anyone flying into Chicago O'Hare the morning of August 2nd who might want to split an Uber? They normally run ~$50 to downtown and I'm not about that life if I can help it. PM me if interested.

Dude, don't bother trying to uber on the Kennedy in the am. Take the blue line. Will probably a shorter trip downtown... and costs $2.50 or whatever.

A city with public transit from the major airport? I've never heard of such a thing. Thanks for the tip.

[bulinus]

On another note: Is anyone flying into Chicago O'Hare the morning of August 2nd who might want to split an Uber? They normally run ~$50 to downtown and I'm not about that life if I can help it. PM me if interested.

Dude, don't bother trying to uber on the Kennedy in the am. Take the blue line. Will probably a shorter trip downtown... and costs $2.50 or whatever.

A city with public transit from the major airport? I've never heard of such a thing. Thanks for the tip.

You will be sitting in your Uber watching the Blue Line train pass you if you ignore this advice.

[PeanutsNJam]

This guy is going to interview with biglaw firms. Just lol if he's gonna take public transit.

[Anonymous User]

This guy is going to interview with biglaw firms. Just lol if he's gonna take public transit.

It's a LOT of time in the morning. Potentially saving 30 minutes. Downside is that it's really humid downtown in the morning, so there's the chance you get soaked.

[PotatoSalad]

This guy is going to interview with biglaw firms. Just lol if he's gonna take public transit.

It's a LOT of time in the morning. Potentially saving 30 minutes. Downside is that it's really humid downtown in the morning, so there's the chance you get soaked.

To clarify, I have every intention of taking the blue line now that I know it is an option. I'm not even debating it, since the whole intent of the original post was to save money if possible. I was and am unfamiliar with Chicago, and I was trying to make a subtle joke about the lack of public transit to/from Dulles International in the DC area.

[Anonymous User]

Ugh, interview cancellations are the worst. I hope they just decided not to come to Loyola at all and they didn't just change their mind on me specifically.