Minnesota firm salaries Forum

[Anonymous User]

I heard there has been some recent movement in associate salaries in Minneapolis, and that both Dorsey and Faegre are going to start at 120.

Does anyone know if other firms (Robins, Fredrikson, Lindquist, Stinson, etc) that were below that amount have also gone up to 120?

Have any of the firms like Briggs previously at 130 made any movement to stay ahead of the market?

[Anonymous User]

I've heard from a reliable source that Fredrikson is raising summers to 2300/wk so I assume that associate pay is also going to 120

[Anonymous User]

My SA firm for 2016 (one of the big 5) implied that this was true but wouldn't commit yet.

[Anonymous User]

Stinson is up to 115 from 110 a year ago. Unknown if they'll boost it to 120 in the coming year.

[Anonymous User]

Interesting. I am surprised Stinson hasn't done anything more yet. Are they still looking to do a summer program in Minneapolis next year?

I can confirm that, with the exception of Stinson, the big firms in Minneapolis have made clear that they are going to 120. Faegre was the first to formally announce earlier this summer. Dorsey was close behind them. Other firms have either made it official or made it clear they will.

Props to Faegre for starting this round of starting salary increases to 120. It was about time, but those of us at other firms who are recognizing trickle down benefits appreciate it!

[Anonymous User]

I noticed in a different thread that cities like Cleveland and Pittsburgh (and even Nahsville?) all start closer to 130-140. Is there a simple explanation why twin cities lags behind smaller secondary markets w/ lower median incomes?

[bruinfan10]

so depressing that this is news. those increases are like rounding errors. at least COL is relatively cheap in the TCs.

re: why TCs comp is so laughably bad, there's a glutted market, the firms don't mind hiring from the homer law schools so they can always fill their classes, and they don't really seem to care that they're bleeding talent to markets with more market-aligned compensation.

[Anonymous User]

Lindquist is up to 120

[Anonymous User]

How do the bonuses compare?

And pay increases? It looks like most firms are lockstep + merit, but some (like Stinson) are pure merit. Any insight on numbers?

[Anonymous User]

I know Faegre and Dorsey increased comp at all levels by similar amounts. Not sure about others.

Most Minneapolis firms are not really lockstep, so associate base compensation, bonuses and total compensation varies and is much harder to compare.

Despite the similar base comp, there are meaningful differences in bonuses between local firms. You should ask firms you are looking at to get into specifics.

[Anonymous User]

anyone know if any of the TC firms offer clerkship bonuses?

[Anonymous User]

For Faegre and Dorsey, what does their lockstep look like? Is it a 5-10k increase yearly?

[bruinfan10]

anyone know if any of the TC firms offer clerkship bonuses?

not one of them does. i know this firsthand.

For Faegre and Dorsey, what does their lockstep look like? Is it a 5-10k increase yearly?

the firms are not very transparent about compensation, and it's not even clear whether you get an increase every year. some of them, at various times, have lumped associates into "bands" of experience, and you only get like a 5k increase when you move from the 1-3 year band or the 3-5 year band. the firms that do increase every year give you salary bumps that are incomparably lower than market, think 2-5k on top of your 120.

[Anonymous User]

Someone in this thread said bonuses are usually $1,000 for first years and $2,000 for second years: http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/v ... p?t=216807. That seems absurdly low.

[Aspen]

What you all aren't talking about is the fact that Twin Cities firms also have lower billable hours expectations than firms in other cities. If you're looking to make tens of thousands of dollars more, also be prepared to work way more. Why should Faegre or Dorsey or any other TC firm pay the same as a big city firm if their billable hours expectations are hundreds of hours less per year....?

[trebekismyhero]

What you all aren't talking about is the fact that Twin Cities firms also have lower billable hours expectations than firms in other cities. If you're looking to make tens of thousands of dollars more, also be prepared to work way more. Why should Faegre or Dorsey or any other TC firm pay the same as a big city firm if their billable hours expectations are hundreds of hours less per year....?

While you are right that their billable requirements are lower, I don't think expectations are lower. I have a couple friends that are mid-levels at Faegre/Dorsey and while the billing requirement is 1800 they almost always go well over 2000 and work late fairly regularly. I don't think anyone is saying that they should pay NYC/Chi lockstep, but they are often paying less than big firms in cities like St. Louis and Milwaukee that are cheaper to live in than Minneapolis

[Anonymous User]

The first year analysts at piper and houlihan will probably make more than a first year associate.

[cron1834]

The first year analysts at piper and houlihan will probably make more than a first year associate.

So will the President of the United States. Most people reading this thread don't get to just choose which they'd rather be, as this isn't a 0L forum. Quit being an anon dick.

[Anonymous User]

Minneapolis might be the only market where that is the case, so yes this is highly relevant to minnesota firm salaries. If you were also in the market you would know why I referred to those specific banks.

[cron1834]

Minneapolis might be the only market where that is the case, so yes this is highly relevant to minnesota firm salaries. If you were also in the market you would know why I referred to those specific banks.

You're not getting it. This is a thread about Mpls law firm salaries for people job hunting or employed in the Mpls legal community. Wtf do first year analyst jobs have to do with this? Comprehension fail.

Edit - I just finished interviewing with a bunch of Mpls firms. I'm from there. You still don't get it, anon dick.

[Anonymous User]

The idea is that Minneapolis salaries are comparatively low to the rest of the country which the thread was discussing earlier.

So chill.

[UVAIce]

I think if you can, and obviously this will not be everyone or even a majority of folks, it's best to start off outside the state at a major law firm and then try to go in-house in-state if you want to stay in Minnesota.

For folks in-state, keep your debt low. I did not want to work in NYC,DC, or another major market and went to another secondary/minor market over coming home to the Twin Cities because of the major gap in compensation - I make more then a senior associate in the Twin cities as a first year and have a much better working environment than my friends at Faegre or Dorsey. Oh, and the city I'm in is cheaper than the Twin Cities. Go figure.

I think the real dog and pony show in the Twin Cities is the fact that the raises are so small and I don't see that changing anytime soon. Bonuses are small and few between - not to mention the fact that I think they are black box.

But it is what it is. I cannot think of a single big firm that crushes the competition in Minnesota. Just expect to make $120k and not a lot more.

* As an aside, I love Minnesota and the Twin Cities in general and miss the state. If you are in Minnesota because you love the state then I would recommend going to a firm with lower hours requirements that fits your personality (something like Lindquist) rather than trying to make it "big."

[Anonymous User]

I think if you can, and obviously this will not be everyone or even a majority of folks, it's best to start off outside the state at a major law firm and then try to go in-house in-state if you want to stay in Minnesota.

For folks in-state, keep your debt low. I did not want to work in NYC,DC, or another major market and went to another secondary/minor market over coming home to the Twin Cities because of the major gap in compensation - I make more then a senior associate in the Twin cities as a first year and have a much better working environment than my friends at Faegre or Dorsey. Oh, and the city I'm in is cheaper than the Twin Cities. Go figure.

I think the real dog and pony show in the Twin Cities is the fact that the raises are so small and I don't see that changing anytime soon. Bonuses are small and few between - not to mention the fact that I think they are black box.

But it is what it is. I cannot think of a single big firm that crushes the competition in Minnesota. Just expect to make $120k and not a lot more.

* As an aside, I love Minnesota and the Twin Cities in general and miss the state. If you are in Minnesota because you love the state then I would recommend going to a firm with lower hours requirements that fits your personality (something like Lindquist) rather than trying to make it "big."

I think this is the right advice for people that want to make more money and be in MN more long term. One of my friends that is at Faegre/Dorsey said that his one regret is not starting his legal career in Chicago when he had the chance just so his salary might be higher now. And I am following his advice now and not going to MN to start my career.

[bruinfan10]

I did not want to work in NYC,DC, or another major market and went to another secondary/minor market over coming home to the Twin Cities because of the major gap in compensation - I make more then a senior associate in the Twin cities as a first year and have a much better working environment than my friends at Faegre or Dorsey. Oh, and the city I'm in is cheaper than the Twin Cities. Go figure.

I think the real dog and pony show in the Twin Cities is the fact that the raises are so small and I don't see that changing anytime soon. Bonuses are small and few between - not to mention the fact that I think they are black box.

This is what the Minnesota firm apologist poster was missing--I have to assume they're like a Hamline 2L or something--but the "you work less hours here you can take off to go walleye fishing anytime!" shtick is largely flame in the TCs. You're expected to work WAY closer to biglaw hours (with the same constant, any second of the day potential plan-canceling demands on your time) than is justified given the gap in compensation (which is about the glacially slow salary increases, not about the low starting salary).

[Anonymous User]

To be fair, Faegre does look like a bit of an outlier: http://www.americanlawyer.com/id=1202735468749

Scores across the city look consistent with most secondary markets, which are on the whole lower than primary markets.