Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3 Forum

Many years ago TLS held a content competition. The competition is no longer active, but this forum keeps going.
User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Sat May 10, 2014 10:34 am

Also, in all fairness, now that I'm not champagned up this morning, I will say the work I did for them at the PDs office almost certainly helped. I was told I write good motions and I work hard.

Because of that, let me add an ADDENDUM:

When you are taking a clinic, externship, internship, law clerking, or doing a summer associate gig - WORK HARD and turn in only you best product. Leave last minute papers for you classes and don't do any work or show up to law school classes. That's fine ( unless you care about grades ). But don't pull this crap when you are doing things in the real world. First off, it does a huge disservice to the clients - people who either really need your help or are at least paying tons of money to get a lawyer to do something. Secondly, and more importantly for this guide's purpose, you can network your ass off and be remembered as an awesome dude... But if they also remember they had to edit your suppression motion/summary judgment brief/memo 5 times and effectively write it themselves, they're going to be like "that guy/gal is so nice and I'd love to go to a BBQ with them, but they are going to be a crappy lawyer." So... Do your best work when you are doing anything practical. Because that's where it pays off.

The Dark Shepard

Bronze
Posts: 450
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 3:49 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by The Dark Shepard » Mon May 26, 2014 10:54 pm

randomly discovered this, but thanks for this Spleen!

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Wed Jul 16, 2014 10:52 am

Bumping for next year's poor bastards.

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Sat Jul 26, 2014 1:27 pm

Last bump until February when people get grades back and realize they are goin to need something else to get a jerb.

User avatar
Scotusnerd

Silver
Posts: 811
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:36 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by Scotusnerd » Mon Aug 04, 2014 11:31 pm

spleenworship wrote:Also, in all fairness, now that I'm not champagned up this morning, I will say the work I did for them at the PDs office almost certainly helped. I was told I write good motions and I work hard.

Because of that, let me add an ADDENDUM:

When you are taking a clinic, externship, internship, law clerking, or doing a summer associate gig - WORK HARD and turn in only you best product. Leave last minute papers for you classes and don't do any work or show up to law school classes. That's fine ( unless you care about grades ). But don't pull this crap when you are doing things in the real world. First off, it does a huge disservice to the clients - people who either really need your help or are at least paying tons of money to get a lawyer to do something. Secondly, and more importantly for this guide's purpose, you can network your ass off and be remembered as an awesome dude... But if they also remember they had to edit your suppression motion/summary judgment brief/memo 5 times and effectively write it themselves, they're going to be like "that guy/gal is so nice and I'd love to go to a BBQ with them, but they are going to be a crappy lawyer." So... Do your best work when you are doing anything practical. Because that's where it pays off.

Wanted to emphasize this to people. I made the mistake of being overconfident in my abilities and turned in something that was crap. I got an ass-reaming for it, and I deserved it. People remember stuff like that.

Also, have a thick skin, and don't expect the lawyers to hold your hand. You may luck out and find a super nice boss who's very supportive of law clerks and has systems in place to help you grow, or you may work for an overstressed jerk who wants you to do monkey work and tells you to go talk to HR for your westlaw password and then gets mad at you when you spend the first day tracking down the stuff you need to access the internal filing system.

Either way, turn in the best work you can. Period, end stop.

Want to continue reading?

Register now to search topics and post comments!

Absolutely FREE!


User avatar
MistakenGenius

Silver
Posts: 824
Joined: Sun Jul 28, 2013 9:18 pm

Post removed.

Post by MistakenGenius » Tue Aug 05, 2014 12:06 am

Post removed.
Last edited by MistakenGenius on Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Tue Aug 05, 2014 2:29 pm

MistakenGenius wrote:Amazing thread Spleen. I know this is for regionals, where networks generally stick in one place and connections are so important, but I might like to do this stuff even in New Haven. Do you think it could hurt in any way?
I can't imagine it would hurt, but that said... You're in a whole other world there from me, so you'll probably need to modify on the fly as necessary. Also, you are prolly in a great position for OCI, BigFed, clerkships, and even nationally ranked PI shit. None of which I was ever in a position for. So just keep that in mind, along with the fact that national circles may have different unwritten rules about networking I'm likely unaware of.

Good luck to you, and I hope this helped in any way.

User avatar
BlueLotus

Gold
Posts: 2416
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:07 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by BlueLotus » Mon Sep 08, 2014 12:32 pm

This is a gem of a thread, spleen. I've used the advice therein to get valuable internships and hopefully it will work for me postgrad as well (fingers crossed!) :)

User avatar
Manteca

Silver
Posts: 1287
Joined: Fri Feb 07, 2014 4:55 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by Manteca » Mon Sep 08, 2014 2:21 pm

Glad to have read this, Spleen. Great advice :D

Want to continue reading?

Register for access!

Did I mention it was FREE ?


User avatar
BlueLotus

Gold
Posts: 2416
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:07 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by BlueLotus » Thu Sep 18, 2014 6:03 am

Spleen, what was your experience applying to clerkships?

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Mon Sep 22, 2014 8:39 pm

BlueLotus wrote:Spleen, what was your experience applying to clerkships?

I got two interviews - a District Court in BFE and a state SC. The District Court Judge interviewed me almost entirely because I had interviewed him for a newsletter, and because I had hung out with him a few times when I interned for him when he was a USA.

That said, obviously neither interview worked out. When you are at that level, it's all about fit with the judge, and I wasn't a fit for either. The Judge preferred (as far as I could tell) a better writer. The Justice wanted someone who had more research experience in her areas of interest.

User avatar
BlueLotus

Gold
Posts: 2416
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:07 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by BlueLotus » Tue Sep 23, 2014 8:17 am

spleenworship wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:Spleen, what was your experience applying to clerkships?

I got two interviews - a District Court in BFE and a state SC. The District Court Judge interviewed me almost entirely because I had interviewed him for a newsletter, and because I had hung out with him a few times when I interned for him when he was a USA.

That said, obviously neither interview worked out. When you are at that level, it's all about fit with the judge, and I wasn't a fit for either. The Judge preferred (as far as I could tell) a better writer. The Justice wanted someone who had more research experience in her areas of interest.
is journal a must? i want to apply for family court clerkships and have a ton of family law experience but no journal. i got an A in family law and have good rapport with the prof.

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Tue Sep 23, 2014 8:44 am

BlueLotus wrote:
spleenworship wrote:
BlueLotus wrote:Spleen, what was your experience applying to clerkships?

I got two interviews - a District Court in BFE and a state SC. The District Court Judge interviewed me almost entirely because I had interviewed him for a newsletter, and because I had hung out with him a few times when I interned for him when he was a USA.

That said, obviously neither interview worked out. When you are at that level, it's all about fit with the judge, and I wasn't a fit for either. The Judge preferred (as far as I could tell) a better writer. The Justice wanted someone who had more research experience in her areas of interest.
is journal a must? i want to apply for family court clerkships and have a ton of family law experience but no journal. i got an A in family law and have good rapport with the prof.
It's my understanding that a journal is absolutely required

Register now!

Resources to assist law school applicants, students & graduates.

It's still FREE!


User avatar
A. Nony Mouse

Diamond
Posts: 29293
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by A. Nony Mouse » Tue Sep 23, 2014 8:47 am

My understanding is that whether journal is a must totally depends on the judge. Some judges won't care at all, some judges won't look at candidates without. (Some will only choose law review people. It varies.) Probably more judges want to see it than don't, but it's not universally required.

However, you do usually have to be able to demonstrate that you're a good writer, so writing stuff on your resume is usually important (if not journal specifically).

User avatar
BlueLotus

Gold
Posts: 2416
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:07 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by BlueLotus » Tue Sep 23, 2014 9:00 am

A. Nony Mouse wrote:My understanding is that whether journal is a must totally depends on the judge. Some judges won't care at all, some judges won't look at candidates without. (Some will only choose law review people. It varies.) Probably more judges want to see it than don't, but it's not universally required.

However, you do usually have to be able to demonstrate that you're a good writer, so writing stuff on your resume is usually important (if not journal specifically).
Thanks for the perspective. Will my lack of moot court hurt too?

User avatar
A. Nony Mouse

Diamond
Posts: 29293
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 11:51 am

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by A. Nony Mouse » Tue Sep 23, 2014 9:31 am

BlueLotus wrote:
A. Nony Mouse wrote:My understanding is that whether journal is a must totally depends on the judge. Some judges won't care at all, some judges won't look at candidates without. (Some will only choose law review people. It varies.) Probably more judges want to see it than don't, but it's not universally required.

However, you do usually have to be able to demonstrate that you're a good writer, so writing stuff on your resume is usually important (if not journal specifically).
Thanks for the perspective. Will my lack of moot court hurt too?
I've honestly never seen anyone care about moot court at all. It's never come up in any interview I've had or interviews that I know of people having.

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Tue Sep 23, 2014 4:11 pm

A. Nony Mouse wrote:My understanding is that whether journal is a must totally depends on the judge. Some judges won't care at all, some judges won't look at candidates without. (Some will only choose law review people. It varies.) Probably more judges want to see it than don't, but it's not universally required.

However, you do usually have to be able to demonstrate that you're a good writer, so writing stuff on your resume is usually important (if not journal specifically).
Hmm. May also be a specific thing in my state.

Everyone not living in my state should definitely take nony's advice as TCR.

Get unlimited access to all forums and topics

Register now!

I'm pretty sure I told you it's FREE...


User avatar
Scotusnerd

Silver
Posts: 811
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 7:36 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by Scotusnerd » Thu Sep 25, 2014 8:03 am

Spleen's journal requirement applies to my state as well, and my guess is we have similar states. For any sort of appellate clerkships, journal is basically a prerequisite.

No one cares about moot court. Depressing but true.

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Mon Jul 20, 2015 10:03 pm

spleenworship wrote:Bumping for next year's poor bastards.

Manali

Bronze
Posts: 436
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2015 5:12 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by Manali » Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:54 pm

This thread is gold. Thanks, spleen!

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Thu Jan 14, 2016 12:11 pm

Manali wrote:This thread is gold. Thanks, spleen!
Thanks. I like to come back a couple times a year and bump this and see who is still on here arguing.

Stupid life keeps me from being a big contributor to TLS anymore.



Oh, I guess as an update to the thread I can say that I love my job as a Public Defender - where networking is still important for promotions and good courtroom assignments. So, everything I said at the beginning is still valuable to me.

Communicate now with those who not only know what a legal education is, but can offer you worthy advice and commentary as you complete the three most educational, yet challenging years of your law related post graduate life.

Register now, it's still FREE!


Manali

Bronze
Posts: 436
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2015 5:12 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by Manali » Mon May 23, 2016 8:47 pm

spleenworship wrote:
Manali wrote:This thread is gold. Thanks, spleen!
Thanks. I like to come back a couple times a year and bump this and see who is still on here arguing.

Stupid life keeps me from being a big contributor to TLS anymore.



Oh, I guess as an update to the thread I can say that I love my job as a Public Defender - where networking is still important for promotions and good courtroom assignments. So, everything I said at the beginning is still valuable to me.
Spleen, are "ties" important to PDs offices in the Southwest? (i.e. NM, AZ)

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Sat May 28, 2016 5:39 pm

Manali wrote:
spleenworship wrote:
Manali wrote:This thread is gold. Thanks, spleen!
Thanks. I like to come back a couple times a year and bump this and see who is still on here arguing.

Stupid life keeps me from being a big contributor to TLS anymore.



Oh, I guess as an update to the thread I can say that I love my job as a Public Defender - where networking is still important for promotions and good courtroom assignments. So, everything I said at the beginning is still valuable to me.
Spleen, are "ties" important to PDs offices in the Southwest? (i.e. NM, AZ)
Yes. 75% of our attorneys come from in state. Another 15% from neighboring states, but most of those in rural areas where it's hard to get anyone to work. Only 1 in 10 come from farther away: Boston, California, Washington (DC and state), Florida, NY, Hawaii, Oregon, are the onlu ones I know of, and again, half of those are in rural offices. And most have ties to the state in one way or another: spouse, parent, undergrad, high school, etc.

User avatar
spleenworship

Gold
Posts: 4394
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2011 11:08 pm

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by spleenworship » Wed Aug 03, 2016 11:23 pm

spleenworship wrote:
spleenworship wrote:Bumping for next year's poor bastards.

User avatar
ashrice13

Gold
Posts: 1793
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2016 10:30 am

Re: Spleen's Guide to Success at a Strong Regional T1/2/3

Post by ashrice13 » Sun Apr 16, 2017 8:37 am

Tag. Thanks for this!

Seriously? What are you waiting for?

Now there's a charge.
Just kidding ... it's still FREE!


Post Reply

Return to “TLS Content Competitions”