Best Law School In South Florida?

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gorillajuice10

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Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby gorillajuice10 » Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:08 am

Hello all,

I am a senior in college and will graduate in the summer. I will study for the LSAT for like 6 months, take it, and then start applying. For personal reasons I really do not want to go outside of South Florida. Right now I'm leaning towards NOVA, or UM. I live in the Coral Springs area in Broward county. Do you guys think its too much of a commute to go to UM?

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magnum_law

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby magnum_law » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:45 am

They are all garbage. But UM is the better one.

lnsjr1

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby lnsjr1 » Tue Mar 06, 2018 11:12 am

UM:

USNWR: 77
LST Employment: 63.5%
LST Cost: $287,145.
Bar Pass Rate: 84.2%

FIU:

USNWR: 100.
LST Employment: 67.3%
LST Cost: $173,465
Bar Pass Rate: 87.8%

NOVA:

USNWR: Unranked.
LST Employment: 47.7%
LST Cost: $252,267
Bar Pass Rate: 70.2%

kyle1978

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby kyle1978 » Tue Mar 06, 2018 1:46 pm

I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

gorillajuice10

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby gorillajuice10 » Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:05 pm

kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Tue Mar 06, 2018 5:55 pm

gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

gorillajuice10

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby gorillajuice10 » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:59 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

It kinda gets me mad that South Florida is the most urban area in Florida, but UF/FSU are all the way in hickville :x

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Tue Mar 06, 2018 7:30 pm

gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

It kinda gets me mad that South Florida is the most urban area in Florida, but UF/FSU are all the way in hickville :x


Right, but UF is the only decent law school in Fl.

gorillajuice10

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby gorillajuice10 » Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:19 am

sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:32 am

gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?


Its not a few years kinda thing. That would be your salary for a long time. And not necessarily public sector either. That is the average pay for an associate at most law firms. Considering you have a 0% chance at biglaw from these schools, your salary will be in the 40k range. Also, that is if you get a job at all. These schools only give you around a 50% chance of working as a lawyer ever.

Truthfully you should wait on law school. The situation you are in now is not conducive to actually attending a decent school and getting a good shot of ever using your law degree.

gorillajuice10

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby gorillajuice10 » Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:42 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?


Its not a few years kinda thing. That would be your salary for a long time. And not necessarily public sector either. That is the average pay for an associate at most law firms. Considering you have a 0% chance at biglaw from these schools, your salary will be in the 40k range. Also, that is if you get a job at all. These schools only give you around a 50% chance of working as a lawyer ever.

Truthfully you should wait on law school. The situation you are in now is not conducive to actually attending a decent school and getting a good shot of ever using your law degree.

By your statistics if I float in the top 50% I should have a shot? It sounds better than my plan to spend 8 years+ for a masters and Ph.D. Marco Rubio went to UM, and he is considered one of the elite. I don't trust vagabond apartment mates, I've been sober for quite a while.

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Wed Mar 07, 2018 1:23 pm

gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?


Its not a few years kinda thing. That would be your salary for a long time. And not necessarily public sector either. That is the average pay for an associate at most law firms. Considering you have a 0% chance at biglaw from these schools, your salary will be in the 40k range. Also, that is if you get a job at all. These schools only give you around a 50% chance of working as a lawyer ever.

Truthfully you should wait on law school. The situation you are in now is not conducive to actually attending a decent school and getting a good shot of ever using your law degree.

By your statistics if I float in the top 50% I should have a shot? It sounds better than my plan to spend 8 years+ for a masters and Ph.D. Marco Rubio went to UM, and he is considered one of the elite. I don't trust vagabond apartment mates, I've been sober for quite a while.



Honestly you just need to do much more research. You have no idea what you are getting into. I would suggest going to work as a paralegal for a few years. There are a ton of places in the Coral Springs/Ft. Lauderdale area that will hire paralegals. Go do that for two years.

fullmetal24

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby fullmetal24 » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:49 am

Any second opinions?

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DKM

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby DKM » Sat Mar 10, 2018 4:53 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?


Its not a few years kinda thing. That would be your salary for a long time. And not necessarily public sector either. That is the average pay for an associate at most law firms. Considering you have a 0% chance at biglaw from these schools, your salary will be in the 40k range. Also, that is if you get a job at all. These schools only give you around a 50% chance of working as a lawyer ever.

Truthfully you should wait on law school. The situation you are in now is not conducive to actually attending a decent school and getting a good shot of ever using your law degree.


Do you have anything to back up your claims besides anecdotal evidence?

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Sat Mar 10, 2018 7:20 pm

DKM wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?


Its not a few years kinda thing. That would be your salary for a long time. And not necessarily public sector either. That is the average pay for an associate at most law firms. Considering you have a 0% chance at biglaw from these schools, your salary will be in the 40k range. Also, that is if you get a job at all. These schools only give you around a 50% chance of working as a lawyer ever.

Truthfully you should wait on law school. The situation you are in now is not conducive to actually attending a decent school and getting a good shot of ever using your law degree.


Do you have anything to back up your claims besides anecdotal evidence?


yeah, its called law school transparency. Oh and go ask actual lawyers in the South Florida area as well.

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DKM

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby DKM » Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:45 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:
DKM wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
sparkytrainer wrote:
gorillajuice10 wrote:
kyle1978 wrote:I'd vote UF/FSU or FIU

I can't move out of South Florida for personal reasons.


Then you should put your law school goals on hold. None of the south florida law schools are worthwhile to attend if you want to ever work as a practicing attorney (maybe UM, but only if its free and you are cool with a 40k a year job).

Source: myself and family practice in south florida

I don't think I would be against working for 40k a year for a few years. I'm thinking your implying a public sector law position?


Its not a few years kinda thing. That would be your salary for a long time. And not necessarily public sector either. That is the average pay for an associate at most law firms. Considering you have a 0% chance at biglaw from these schools, your salary will be in the 40k range. Also, that is if you get a job at all. These schools only give you around a 50% chance of working as a lawyer ever.

Truthfully you should wait on law school. The situation you are in now is not conducive to actually attending a decent school and getting a good shot of ever using your law degree.


Do you have anything to back up your claims besides anecdotal evidence?


yeah, its called law school transparency. Oh and go ask actual lawyers in the South Florida area as well.
.
Could you linnk it? I checked LST but must've been looking in the wrong place.

fullmetal24

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby fullmetal24 » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:49 am

DKM what you think?

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DKM

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby DKM » Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:27 pm

fullmetal24 wrote:DKM what you think?

I think that you should do your research on these schools. I'm not saying they're great, but if you can get in with a good price and want to practice in FL I think it could work out for you. I don't understand where that guy was getting his numbers from; the source he said he used said nothing of the sort.

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:10 pm

DKM wrote:
fullmetal24 wrote:DKM what you think?

I think that you should do your research on these schools. I'm not saying they're great, but if you can get in with a good price and want to practice in FL I think it could work out for you. I don't understand where that guy was getting his numbers from; the source he said he used said nothing of the sort.



Lets start with the numbers and each of the three relevant schools:

Nova
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/nova/jobs/
Only 49% of Nova Law graduates get a legal job. Think about that. You have better odds flipping a coin than getting a legal job from Nova after 3 years.
The salary range for ALL of those 49% that do get legal jobs are within a 40k-60k bracket. Exactly like I said earlier. Not a single person who was lucky enough to get a legal job after graduating nova got a salary over 60k. These jobs don't magically grow into 100k+ jobs after a few years.

FIU
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/fiu/jobs/
70% of FIU grads got legal jobs. This is a much better rate than Nova, but still not great odds. Only 2% of those graduates got biglaw jobs (the jobs that pay 140k+). That is a TINY NUMBER. That is literally 2 or 3 of the total graduates. So statistically insignificant as to not be worthy of considering a viable option. Just under 50% of those who got legal jobs work in firms either as a solo attorney up to firms with 10 attorneys. FIU does not release the salary data for that (I wonder what they are hiding???), but those jobs are 40-60k, the exact same jobs Nova grads are fighting their asses off for. Another 15% are working in gov't jobs, which would mean local or state jobs, which are in the 30-50k salary range.

Now if there is a half-viable school, it is UM. But the data isn't all sunshine and rainbows either.
UM:
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/miami/jobs/
ONLY 64% of UM grads GOT LEGAL JOBS AT ALL!! That is an AWFUL number (but obviously not as bad as nova). You have barely over a coin flips chance of ever working as a lawyer from UM.
Out of the 45% of those jobs that reported a salary (likely because the other 20% or so are school fellowships and stuff that pay literally 10-15k for the year for those who can't find jobs), only 22% of those 45% are making over 60k. Think about that. The website shows 323 graduates. 45% of that is 145 students. 22% of that population is 32 students. So you have a 1 out of 10 chance OF MAKING MORE THAN 60K. This is surely more than either Nova or FIU, but a 10% chance of making more than 60k is insane. Let alone the fact that only just a hair more than half the class ever works as lawyers.

Listen, I think there are viable options for someone who wants to work in Florida. That option is going to UF for free. Otherwise, the time sink of cost (even if tuition free, there are living expenses to pay) and the loss of opportunity to make any money for those three years is NOT worth the chances you get from these schools.

OP does not need to rush into law school. If OP wants to stay in the South Florida area for personal reasons, then OP should work as a paralegal (or literally do anything else). Then when OP is ready to leave, retake the lsat and go to a school that gives you both employment opportunities and the chance to make money.

I firmly believe these schools are not worthwhile to attend. I can see someone making an argument for FIU or UM for free and a stipend, but even that is a fairly high risk proposition.

The data doesn't lie.

TirantMartorell

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby TirantMartorell » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:42 pm

If you absolutely cannot leave South Florida, you should only go to UM and if the price is almost free.

You really should leave South Florida. The top firms in the area only hire entry level associates who are at the very top of their class at UM or UF or those from top law schools out of state.

UM for free or very little is acceptable but know you probaboy won't be making over $60K after graduation.

fullmetal24

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby fullmetal24 » Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:52 am

sparkytrainer wrote:
DKM wrote:
fullmetal24 wrote:DKM what you think?

I think that you should do your research on these schools. I'm not saying they're great, but if you can get in with a good price and want to practice in FL I think it could work out for you. I don't understand where that guy was getting his numbers from; the source he said he used said nothing of the sort.



Lets start with the numbers and each of the three relevant schools:

Nova
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/nova/jobs/
Only 49% of Nova Law graduates get a legal job. Think about that. You have better odds flipping a coin than getting a legal job from Nova after 3 years.
The salary range for ALL of those 49% that do get legal jobs are within a 40k-60k bracket. Exactly like I said earlier. Not a single person who was lucky enough to get a legal job after graduating nova got a salary over 60k. These jobs don't magically grow into 100k+ jobs after a few years.

FIU
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/fiu/jobs/
70% of FIU grads got legal jobs. This is a much better rate than Nova, but still not great odds. Only 2% of those graduates got biglaw jobs (the jobs that pay 140k+). That is a TINY NUMBER. That is literally 2 or 3 of the total graduates. So statistically insignificant as to not be worthy of considering a viable option. Just under 50% of those who got legal jobs work in firms either as a solo attorney up to firms with 10 attorneys. FIU does not release the salary data for that (I wonder what they are hiding???), but those jobs are 40-60k, the exact same jobs Nova grads are fighting their asses off for. Another 15% are working in gov't jobs, which would mean local or state jobs, which are in the 30-50k salary range.

Now if there is a half-viable school, it is UM. But the data isn't all sunshine and rainbows either.
UM:
https://www.lstreports.com/schools/miami/jobs/
ONLY 64% of UM grads GOT LEGAL JOBS AT ALL!! That is an AWFUL number (but obviously not as bad as nova). You have barely over a coin flips chance of ever working as a lawyer from UM.
Out of the 45% of those jobs that reported a salary (likely because the other 20% or so are school fellowships and stuff that pay literally 10-15k for the year for those who can't find jobs), only 22% of those 45% are making over 60k. Think about that. The website shows 323 graduates. 45% of that is 145 students. 22% of that population is 32 students. So you have a 1 out of 10 chance OF MAKING MORE THAN 60K. This is surely more than either Nova or FIU, but a 10% chance of making more than 60k is insane. Let alone the fact that only just a hair more than half the class ever works as lawyers.

Listen, I think there are viable options for someone who wants to work in Florida. That option is going to UF for free. Otherwise, the time sink of cost (even if tuition free, there are living expenses to pay) and the loss of opportunity to make any money for those three years is NOT worth the chances you get from these schools.

OP does not need to rush into law school. If OP wants to stay in the South Florida area for personal reasons, then OP should work as a paralegal (or literally do anything else). Then when OP is ready to leave, retake the lsat and go to a school that gives you both employment opportunities and the chance to make money.

I firmly believe these schools are not worthwhile to attend. I can see someone making an argument for FIU or UM for free and a stipend, but even that is a fairly high risk proposition.

The data doesn't lie.

That website says UF employment score is 70.6%.. Which makes me ask why go to UF if it is only 7% more employment than UM

fullmetal24

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby fullmetal24 » Wed Mar 14, 2018 9:35 am

I guess we can conclude that UF only has 6-7% chance of more employment than UM and that sparky was going on an elitist rant..

sparkytrainer

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby sparkytrainer » Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:13 am

fullmetal24 wrote:I guess we can conclude that UF only has 6-7% chance of more employment than UM and that sparky was going on an elitist rant..


To be clear, I did not attend a law school in Florida. I went to a t13.

That 7% difference is a big difference, when you factor in the fact that UF is in-state and much cheaper than UM. UF is very generous with scholarship money so its not difficult to get a full ride there. In that case, then it may be worthwhile, which is exactly what I said earlier. The 7% difference plus the difference in cost makes it a significantly better option, but still not a fantastic option. It just happens to be the best option in the state, but that isn't saying too much.

Truthfully, the Florida market is contracting fairly heavily. At my t13, a group of 15 of us who were native born south floridians and all grew up in the Miami/Broward/Palm Beach area attempted to get biglaw. Only a handful got a biglaw job in the area.

Plus from working and living down here, if you talk to lawyers who went to law school in state, there is a very clear florida tier list. That tier list is
1. UF
2. FSU/UM depending on which side of the state you are in
3. Any other Florida school

But anyway, all I am trying to do is point out that going to a south florida law school is a bad idea in pretty much any circumstance.

gorillajuice10

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Re: Best Law School In South Florida?

Postby gorillajuice10 » Wed Mar 14, 2018 1:04 pm

sparkytrainer wrote:
fullmetal24 wrote:I guess we can conclude that UF only has 6-7% chance of more employment than UM and that sparky was going on an elitist rant..


To be clear, I did not attend a law school in Florida. I went to a t13.

That 7% difference is a big difference, when you factor in the fact that UF is in-state and much cheaper than UM. UF is very generous with scholarship money so its not difficult to get a full ride there. In that case, then it may be worthwhile, which is exactly what I said earlier. The 7% difference plus the difference in cost makes it a significantly better option, but still not a fantastic option. It just happens to be the best option in the state, but that isn't saying too much.

Truthfully, the Florida market is contracting fairly heavily. At my t13, a group of 15 of us who were native born south floridians and all grew up in the Miami/Broward/Palm Beach area attempted to get biglaw. Only a handful got a biglaw job in the area.

Plus from working and living down here, if you talk to lawyers who went to law school in state, there is a very clear florida tier list. That tier list is
1. UF
2. FSU/UM depending on which side of the state you are in
3. Any other Florida school

But anyway, all I am trying to do is point out that going to a south florida law school is a bad idea in pretty much any circumstance.

Hmm, I will get back on the forums when I start applying to law schools. I will apply to the schools we discussed and some t12s as well. I just want to discuss about room and board.. I just really don't want a partying/pot smoking roommate. Is that hard to find?



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