2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

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nxxxnda
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2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 3:56 am

Hi,

I was wondering if anyone is able to give me any advice for the 2018 cycle.

I am a graduating undergrad with a 2.8 gpa and 173 LSAT score;. My grades show an upward slope but I had 3 Ds and 1 F in a particular semester as a sophomore due to a Title IX issue. But I have received honor recognitions.

I also have about 4-5 years of working-professional experience. I held an internship for a Americorp for a year. I also served on the exec board of an international org on my campus.

Any suggestions on how to strengthen my application? I don’t know if I have a chance in getting admitted to a top20 school
Last edited by nxxxnda on Tue May 30, 2017 1:48 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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BansheeScream
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby BansheeScream » Thu May 18, 2017 4:06 am

I think you have a solid shot at a number of T13s. A lot of schools want to increase their LSAT medians and your super splitter status could be viewed favorably. Apply broadly though because outcomes for super splitters are hard to predict. Your work experience will separate you from your UGPA slightly too. I may be reading your post wrong but you are not a K-JD correct?

One part of your post that stuck out to me was you mentioned a Title IX issue. I'm not sure if you were the complainant or the respondent but if you were the respondent theres a good chance you're going to run into some serious C&F issues which would require you to reevaluate your situation. If you're the complainant, I'm sure somebody can provide advice on how to write an appropriate GPA addendum.

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 7:32 am

Thank you so much for your feedback.

In the Title IX issue I was the complainant.

However, Im not entirely sure what it means to be a K-JD but if I'm right in assuming it's a question of whether or not I took a gap year...I plan on taking only 1 gap year which is from this may '17 and hopefully starting law school in fall '18. And I have yet to stop school since kindergarten.

B90
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby B90 » Thu May 18, 2017 8:30 am

nxxxnda wrote:Thank you so much for your feedback.

In the Title IX issue I was the complainant.

However, Im not entirely sure what it means to be a K-JD but if I'm right in assuming it's a question of whether or not I took a gap year...I plan on taking only 1 gap year which is from this may '17 and hopefully starting law school in fall '18. And I have yet to stop school since kindergarten.

You are correct about what k-jd means. I assume your three years of work experience were during college. Were they full or part time?
I was also a splitter, but much lower lsat. I listed the number of hours worked at each job on my resume so that schools would know that I worked 35 hours plus per week while going to school full time.

albanach
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby albanach » Thu May 18, 2017 10:31 am

Was your TItle IX complaint successful? Could you petition the school to change those grades to something non-punitive? I'd look into that before graduation. If you had a lawyer, talk to them.

grades??
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby grades?? » Thu May 18, 2017 10:36 am

I mean this with all seriousness- if you filed a title IX complaint and it wasn't successful (after thinking about this more the following advice should also be followed if it was successful), I would consult with a lawyer before law school apps. The reason being title ix complaints are a really sticky subject for a bunch of schools right now. For example, go read Laura Kipnis's new book about the disaster that happened at Northwestern. I don't mean this to disparage you OP, but your application is going to have to be EXTREMELY carefully worded and presented. Because of this, I would consult with a professional.

IExistedOnceBefore
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby IExistedOnceBefore » Thu May 18, 2017 11:28 am

Consult with an attorney on the title ix and also if you really want to go to law school, delay graduation if possible. Take some easy community college classes this summer and get As in them and stall your degree conferral until your GPA is up.

Of course this may not be feasible but something to look into. Your GPA isn't set in stone until you have your bachelors conferred.

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 12:45 pm

B90 wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:Thank you so much for your feedback.

In the Title IX issue I was the complainant.

However, Im not entirely sure what it means to be a K-JD but if I'm right in assuming it's a question of whether or not I took a gap year...I plan on taking only 1 gap year which is from this may '17 and hopefully starting law school in fall '18. And I have yet to stop school since kindergarten.

You are correct about what k-jd means. I assume your three years of work experience were during college. Were they full or part time?
I was also a splitter, but much lower lsat. I listed the number of hours worked at each job on my resume so that schools would know that I worked 35 hours plus per week while going to school full time.


I think my work experience is a bit over 5 years. And my jobs were all part time but my hours were full time. There was a 2 year period in which I was doing 2 jobs and going to school full time. I've been working nonstop since 2013. Would it be ideal to put the hours worked on a resume?

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 12:49 pm

albanach wrote:Was your TItle IX complaint successful? Could you petition the school to change those grades to something non-punitive? I'd look into that before graduation. If you had a lawyer, talk to them.



Unfortunately no. I transferred from a community college where it all initially started and I was told that they couldn't do anything without evidence. My situation was that I had a stalker who left threatening messages on my car, followed me to my classes (even though he wasn't in them), harass my friends about me, and talking to professors about how upset he was with me and I've never talked to him.

Then after moving to a university, he was also in that university in the same classes as I was and the same behavior ensued. Followed by me going to the Title IX office in which the advisor told me she would issue a no-contact order but ended up not doing so because she believed he was "sincere" in saying he didn't know I was uncomfortable and I was then told to be sure that I was aggressive in the way I say "no" and that "women tend to misread and misinterpret signs"


This guy took tests in classes he wasn't in!! I use to go into a panic attack seeing him.
Last edited by nxxxnda on Thu May 18, 2017 1:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 12:51 pm

grades?? wrote:I mean this with all seriousness- if you filed a title IX complaint and it wasn't successful (after thinking about this more the following advice should also be followed if it was successful), I would consult with a lawyer before law school apps. The reason being title ix complaints are a really sticky subject for a bunch of schools right now. For example, go read Laura Kipnis's new book about the disaster that happened at Northwestern. I don't mean this to disparage you OP, but your application is going to have to be EXTREMELY carefully worded and presented. Because of this, I would consult with a professional.


Would it be best to just not mention the issue then?

B90
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby B90 » Thu May 18, 2017 12:51 pm

nxxxnda wrote:
B90 wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:Thank you so much for your feedback.

In the Title IX issue I was the complainant.

However, Im not entirely sure what it means to be a K-JD but if I'm right in assuming it's a question of whether or not I took a gap year...I plan on taking only 1 gap year which is from this may '17 and hopefully starting law school in fall '18. And I have yet to stop school since kindergarten.

You are correct about what k-jd means. I assume your three years of work experience were during college. Were they full or part time?
I was also a splitter, but much lower lsat. I listed the number of hours worked at each job on my resume so that schools would know that I worked 35 hours plus per week while going to school full time.


I think my work experience is a bit over 5 years. And my jobs were all part time but my hours were full time. There was a 2 year period in which I was doing 2 jobs and going to school full time. I've been working nonstop since 2013. Would it be ideal to put the hours worked on a resume?


I did and was accepted. I obviously cannot say whether it would help, but I cannot imagine a scenario where it would hurt. You want to look at your app as a whole. Ask yourself what questions an adcom might have and then answer them. NEVER leave a (rhetorical) question unanswered, because the adcom will not answer it in your favor.

B90
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby B90 » Thu May 18, 2017 12:51 pm

nxxxnda wrote:
B90 wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:Thank you so much for your feedback.

In the Title IX issue I was the complainant.

However, Im not entirely sure what it means to be a K-JD but if I'm right in assuming it's a question of whether or not I took a gap year...I plan on taking only 1 gap year which is from this may '17 and hopefully starting law school in fall '18. And I have yet to stop school since kindergarten.

You are correct about what k-jd means. I assume your three years of work experience were during college. Were they full or part time?
I was also a splitter, but much lower lsat. I listed the number of hours worked at each job on my resume so that schools would know that I worked 35 hours plus per week while going to school full time.


I think my work experience is a bit over 5 years. And my jobs were all part time but my hours were full time. There was a 2 year period in which I was doing 2 jobs and going to school full time. I've been working nonstop since 2013. Would it be ideal to put the hours worked on a resume?


I did and was accepted. I obviously cannot say whether it would help, but I cannot imagine a scenario where it would hurt. You want to look at your app as a whole. Ask yourself what questions an adcom might have and then answer them. NEVER leave a (rhetorical) question unanswered, because the adcom will not answer it in your favor.

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 12:53 pm

B90 wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:
B90 wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:Thank you so much for your feedback.

In the Title IX issue I was the complainant.

However, Im not entirely sure what it means to be a K-JD but if I'm right in assuming it's a question of whether or not I took a gap year...I plan on taking only 1 gap year which is from this may '17 and hopefully starting law school in fall '18. And I have yet to stop school since kindergarten.

You are correct about what k-jd means. I assume your three years of work experience were during college. Were they full or part time?
I was also a splitter, but much lower lsat. I listed the number of hours worked at each job on my resume so that schools would know that I worked 35 hours plus per week while going to school full time.


I think my work experience is a bit over 5 years. And my jobs were all part time but my hours were full time. There was a 2 year period in which I was doing 2 jobs and going to school full time. I've been working nonstop since 2013. Would it be ideal to put the hours worked on a resume?



I did and was accepted. I obviously cannot say whether it would help, but I cannot imagine a scenario where it would hurt. You want to look at your app as a whole. Ask yourself what questions an adcom might have and then answer them. NEVER leave a (rhetorical) question unanswered, because the adcom will not answer it in your favor.




THANK YOU SO MUCH!

grades??
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby grades?? » Thu May 18, 2017 12:58 pm

nxxxnda wrote:
albanach wrote:Was your TItle IX complaint successful? Could you petition the school to change those grades to something non-punitive? I'd look into that before graduation. If you had a lawyer, talk to them.



Unfortunate no. I transferred from a community college where it all initially started and I was told that they couldn't do anything without evidence. My situation was that I had a stalker who left threatening messages on my car, followed me to my classes (even though he wasn't in them), harass my friends about me, and talking to professors about how upset he was with me and I've never talked to him.

Then after moving to a university, he was also in that university in the same classes as I was and the same behavior ensued. Followed by me going to the Title IX office in which the advisor told me she would issue a no-contact order but ended up not doing so because she believed he was "sincere" in saying he didn't know I was uncomfortable and I was then told to be sure that I was aggressive in the way I say "no" and that "women tend to misread and misinterpret signs"


This guy took tests in classes he wasn't in!! I use to go into a panic attack seeing him.


Im sorry this happened to you, but you are going to have to be extremely careful in presenting this to adcoms. Please hire a lawyer and possibly a professional who works on admissions stuff for applicants. You need to present this the right way given how scared schools are of anything title ix right now

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Thu May 18, 2017 1:12 pm

grades?? wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:
albanach wrote:Was your TItle IX complaint successful? Could you petition the school to change those grades to something non-punitive? I'd look into that before graduation. If you had a lawyer, talk to them.



Unfortunate no. I transferred from a community college where it all initially started and I was told that they couldn't do anything without evidence. My situation was that I had a stalker who left threatening messages on my car, followed me to my classes (even though he wasn't in them), harass my friends about me, and talking to professors about how upset he was with me and I've never talked to him.

Then after moving to a university, he was also in that university in the same classes as I was and the same behavior ensued. Followed by me going to the Title IX office in which the advisor told me she would issue a no-contact order but ended up not doing so because she believed he was "sincere" in saying he didn't know I was uncomfortable and I was then told to be sure that I was aggressive in the way I say "no" and that "women tend to misread and misinterpret signs"


This guy took tests in classes he wasn't in!! I use to go into a panic attack seeing him.


Im sorry this happened to you, but you are going to have to be extremely careful in presenting this to adcoms. Please hire a lawyer and possibly a professional who works on admissions stuff for applicants. You need to present this the right way given how scared schools are of anything title ix right now


Oh okay, I'll try to see if I can talk to someone who works on admissions. THANK YOU!

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Tiago Splitter
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby Tiago Splitter » Thu May 18, 2017 7:19 pm

grades?? wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:
albanach wrote:Was your TItle IX complaint successful? Could you petition the school to change those grades to something non-punitive? I'd look into that before graduation. If you had a lawyer, talk to them.



Unfortunate no. I transferred from a community college where it all initially started and I was told that they couldn't do anything without evidence. My situation was that I had a stalker who left threatening messages on my car, followed me to my classes (even though he wasn't in them), harass my friends about me, and talking to professors about how upset he was with me and I've never talked to him.

Then after moving to a university, he was also in that university in the same classes as I was and the same behavior ensued. Followed by me going to the Title IX office in which the advisor told me she would issue a no-contact order but ended up not doing so because she believed he was "sincere" in saying he didn't know I was uncomfortable and I was then told to be sure that I was aggressive in the way I say "no" and that "women tend to misread and misinterpret signs"


This guy took tests in classes he wasn't in!! I use to go into a panic attack seeing him.


Im sorry this happened to you, but you are going to have to be extremely careful in presenting this to adcoms. Please hire a lawyer and possibly a professional who works on admissions stuff for applicants. You need to present this the right way given how scared schools are of anything title ix right now

I don't see why the OP needs to present this to adcomms. A short addendum explaining the bad grades in that one semester without specifically mentioning Title IX or getting into details should be fine.

carsondalywashere
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby carsondalywashere » Thu May 18, 2017 10:03 pm

Curious bystander looking to learn here; why would someone who filed a title IX, a victim of harassment, face a difficult time getting into school? I can understand why it would be hard for the perpetrator.

grades??
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby grades?? » Thu May 18, 2017 10:09 pm

carsondalywashere wrote:Curious bystander looking to learn here; why would someone who filed a title IX, a victim of harassment, face a difficult time getting into school?


I raised my concern because it seemed like OP might include the title ix stuff into a gpa addendum or personal statement. There is a lot of pressure on schools to deal with title ix complaints extremely harshly even with a lack of evidence against alleged perps. For a great example of this Laura Kiplin just published a new book about a title ix disaster that occurred at Northwestern. It is a really in-depth look at how title ix investigations are kangaroo courts. Further examples recently include Baylor. They raise serious issues and OP likely was in a real shitty spot, but if I am an adcom with two identical candidates, but one has filed a title ix complaint that was unsuccessful and the other hasn't, I bet you can guess which will get in.

Again this is all speculation on my part, but schools are really really nervous dealing with title ix issues and if OP had a title ix complaint, it would behoove OP to make sure it is a meticulous application so it doesn't even put a shred of doubt into an adcom's mind.

Edit: and I told this earlier to OP, it is a really awful thing that happened to OP. I hope OP crushes life and gets into a great law school. But OP needs to walk a fine line in my random internet person opinion with her application. Hence talk to some professionals to make sure its perfect. Thats all.

Npret
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby Npret » Thu May 18, 2017 10:12 pm

grades?? wrote:
carsondalywashere wrote:Curious bystander looking to learn here; why would someone who filed a title IX, a victim of harassment, face a difficult time getting into school?


I raised my concern because it seemed like OP might include the title ix stuff into a gpa addendum or personal statement. There is a lot of pressure on schools to deal with title ix complaints extremely harshly even with a lack of evidence against alleged perps. For a great example of this Laura Kiplin just published a new book about a title ix disaster that occurred at Northwestern. It is a really in-depth look at how title ix investigations are kangaroo courts. Further examples recently include Baylor. They raise serious issues and OP likely was in a real shitty spot, but if I am an adcom with two identical candidates, but one has filed a title ix complaint that was unsuccessful and the other hasn't, I bet you can guess which will get in.

Again this is all speculation on my part, but schools are really really nervous dealing with title ix issues and if OP had a title ix complaint, it would behoove OP to make sure it is a meticulous application so it doesn't even put a shred of doubt into an adcom's mind.

I don't agree with this take at all. Maybe ask Spivey for input. I think you are dead wrong.
Agree OP should have a meticulous application but everyone should. There's no excuse for sloppy application

grades??
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby grades?? » Thu May 18, 2017 10:14 pm

Npret wrote:
grades?? wrote:
carsondalywashere wrote:Curious bystander looking to learn here; why would someone who filed a title IX, a victim of harassment, face a difficult time getting into school?


I raised my concern because it seemed like OP might include the title ix stuff into a gpa addendum or personal statement. There is a lot of pressure on schools to deal with title ix complaints extremely harshly even with a lack of evidence against alleged perps. For a great example of this Laura Kiplin just published a new book about a title ix disaster that occurred at Northwestern. It is a really in-depth look at how title ix investigations are kangaroo courts. Further examples recently include Baylor. They raise serious issues and OP likely was in a real shitty spot, but if I am an adcom with two identical candidates, but one has filed a title ix complaint that was unsuccessful and the other hasn't, I bet you can guess which will get in.

Again this is all speculation on my part, but schools are really really nervous dealing with title ix issues and if OP had a title ix complaint, it would behoove OP to make sure it is a meticulous application so it doesn't even put a shred of doubt into an adcom's mind.

I don't agree with this take at all. Maybe ask Spivey for input. I think you are dead wrong.
Agree OP should have a meticulous application but everyone should. There's no excuse for sloppy application


Listen I am fine about being dead wrong here but if it got OP to talk to a professional to make sure I am dead wrong, then my purpose was served completely. But OP should do that just in case this might raise some internal bias with a random adcom somewhere, especially if OP has any of this story in a gpa addendum.

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Fri May 19, 2017 4:41 pm

I was thinking of doing an addendum to briefly explain why I basically failed all of my classes in 1 semester.

I wasn't entirely sure as to how to even talk about it considering the fact that I was unsuccessful with 2 schools in getting it resolved...to be quite honest I feel extremely discouraged even bringing it up in my application and maybe just take chances with my GPA and hope an adcom can see past it given everything else in my application.

It sucks that something someone does to you can only have a negative impact on you. And I was not really going to incorporate my Title IX issue anywhere else in my application because I refuse to let that one situation be the story to get me into law school...

Is an addendum a make it or break it for someone with my similar application?

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NotAGolfer
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby NotAGolfer » Fri May 19, 2017 5:12 pm

nxxxnda wrote:I was thinking of doing an addendum to briefly explain why I basically failed all of my classes in 1 semester.

I wasn't entirely sure as to how to even talk about it considering the fact that I was unsuccessful with 2 schools in getting it resolved...to be quite honest I feel extremely discouraged even bringing it up in my application and maybe just take chances with my GPA and hope an adcom can see past it given everything else in my application.

It sucks that something someone does to you can only have a negative impact on you. And I was not really going to incorporate my Title IX issue anywhere else in my application because I refuse to let that one situation be the story to get me into law school...

Is an addendum a make it or break it for someone with my similar application?

This is terrible, I'm so sorry you had to deal with this (and that you continue to have to deal with it)

If you get to the interview stage at any law school they will ask you about it, so unfortunately I don't think you can avoid talking about it entirely. I can imagine an adcom might think the worst (partying, drug/alcohol abuse, etc) if there was no addendum to explain why you had such a bad semester. I am also a splitter and had a lot of success this cycle. I wrote a GPA addendum because I had a bad semester/year related to illness. I kept it very brief and factual and highlighted my strong upward trend. I think you could take a similar approach. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss more in detail.

I agree with others that it might make sense to consult with an expert though; I've never been an adcom so I don't know how they view things like this.

nxxxnda
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Re: 2.8 GPA with a 173 LSAT

Postby nxxxnda » Fri May 19, 2017 5:42 pm

NotAGolfer wrote:
nxxxnda wrote:I was thinking of doing an addendum to briefly explain why I basically failed all of my classes in 1 semester.

I wasn't entirely sure as to how to even talk about it considering the fact that I was unsuccessful with 2 schools in getting it resolved...to be quite honest I feel extremely discouraged even bringing it up in my application and maybe just take chances with my GPA and hope an adcom can see past it given everything else in my application.

It sucks that something someone does to you can only have a negative impact on you. And I was not really going to incorporate my Title IX issue anywhere else in my application because I refuse to let that one situation be the story to get me into law school...

Is an addendum a make it or break it for someone with my similar application?

This is terrible, I'm so sorry you had to deal with this (and that you continue to have to deal with it)

If you get to the interview stage at any law school they will ask you about it, so unfortunately I don't think you can avoid talking about it entirely. I can imagine an adcom might think the worst (partying, drug/alcohol abuse, etc) if there was no addendum to explain why you had such a bad semester. I am also a splitter and had a lot of success this cycle. I wrote a GPA addendum because I had a bad semester/year related to illness. I kept it very brief and factual and highlighted my strong upward trend. I think you could take a similar approach. Feel free to PM me if you want to discuss more in detail.

I agree with others that it might make sense to consult with an expert though; I've never been an adcom so I don't know how they view things like this.


I appreciate your feedback and congratulations on all the success you've been having and will continue to have!

Unfortunately, I am leaning more towards not writing an addendum. I spoke to my boss (who is an attorney and a supervising attorney at my internship) and they told me that bringing it up even in a gpa addendum will only make me stand out in a negative way especially since 2 campuses didn't want to substantiate my claim even though it was their faculties that brought it up to my attention, but since nothing physically was done to me, it wasn't enough.

I think I've just come to terms with this and just hope for the best when I apply for my cycle.

Unfortunate. But I don't know what else to do. I refuse to let this story keep hurting my future.




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