Harvard to Allow GRE in Place of LSAT Forum

[BrainsyK]

https://today.law.harvard.edu/gre/

"Starting in the fall of 2017, Harvard Law School will allow applicants to submit either the Graduate Record Examination (GRE) or the Law School Admissions Test (LSAT) to be considered for admission to its three-year J.D. program."

What do y'all think?

[heythatslife]

YS-HCCN is confirmed and here to stay

[bloomsday]

.

[34iplaw]

I'm skeptical.

First, their LSAT 25%ile is 97%ile of LSAT takers which would be roughly 166-67/170 if we assume somewhat similar aptitude of the respective bodies that take the test. If we look at medians, a 99%ile on the GRE is a 169-170/170. My gut is this will be used to replace some of their lower LSAT scorers.

Beyond that,

"The Law School’s decision to accept the GRE will alleviate the financial burden on applicants who would otherwise be required to prepare and pay for an additional test."

is a joke, IMO. There is some validity, but LSAT prep costs pale in comparison to your ~190K tuition. Maybe lowering your tuition would help signal a change that would make law school more accessible.

[lymenheimer]

Brb. Dropping out of 1L to take gre and get into harvard.

[bloomsday]

.

[xn3345]

How is this about anything besides increasing the number of people they get to reject every year?

[dj9i27]

me rn

[+] Spoiler

[theboringest]

"The Law School’s decision to accept the GRE will alleviate the financial burden on applicants who would otherwise be required to prepare and pay for an additional test."

is a joke, IMO. There is some validity, but LSAT prep costs pale in comparison to your ~190K tuition. Maybe lowering your tuition would help signal a change that would make law school more accessible.

They know literally 0 people buy that right?

[cavalier1138]

"The Law School’s decision to accept the GRE will alleviate the financial burden on applicants who would otherwise be required to prepare and pay for an additional test."

is a joke, IMO. There is some validity, but LSAT prep costs pale in comparison to your ~190K tuition. Maybe lowering your tuition would help signal a change that would make law school more accessible.

What? Who was paying to take both?

[Veil of Ignorance]

They could use this to increase their GPA median without hurting their LSAT median. I'd wager that if you provide the GRE you'll need a 3.9+ to get in. This is probably not good news for reverse splitters, too.

[34iplaw]

"The Law School’s decision to accept the GRE will alleviate the financial burden on applicants who would otherwise be required to prepare and pay for an additional test."

is a joke, IMO. There is some validity, but LSAT prep costs pale in comparison to your ~190K tuition. Maybe lowering your tuition would help signal a change that would make law school more accessible.

What? Who was paying to take both?

I guess dual degree applicants or people who have completed previous masters degrees. Either way, I don't really think graduate schools should comment on the cost of test prep with tuitions as high as they are. Law schools are particularly bad because the weight placed on the LSAT means a few points can be worth tens of thousands of dollars provided a good enough UGPA. Granted, I haven't looked at other types of graduate schools, but I get the feeling it's not remotely the same.

Either way, HLS trying to pass this off as some sort of altruistic endeavor...

[+] Spoiler

I'm done here, though. I don't really care all that much about it other than finding it to be an interesting move. I don't want to come across as someone who cares about anything... shudder.

[heythatslife]

I suspect this was approved by a strange coalition of admissions office people who wanted to game the GPA and professors who thought this would actually have a meaningful beneficial impact (although why would anyone who's serious about attending law school not take the exam that would allow them to be considered for every other law school in the country?), neither of whom necessarily share the other's agenda.

[Npret]

The GRE is not only easier but also it is a computer based test you can take on your own schedule and even better you get the results before you leave the testing center. No more stressing for test day and anxiously waiting for results.

Only possible issue is that if you don't get the easier questions correct you don't get to seethe harder questions so you can't get the highest score.

Maybe this will light a fire under LSAC to improve quickly, they are about to get lapped.

[Npret]

They could use this to increase their GPA median without hurting their LSAT median. I'd wager that if you provide the GRE you'll need a 3.9+ to get in. This is probably not good news for reverse splitters, too.

Not so sure. I would take the GRE and get an instant score. If it was high enough I might just roll with it.

[dj9i27]

The GRE is not only easier but also it is a computer based test you can take on your own schedule and even better you get the results before you leave the testing center. No more stressing for test day and anxiously waiting for results.

Only possible issue is that if you don't get the easier questions correct you don't get to seethe harder questions so you can't get the highest score.

Maybe this will light a fire under LSAC to improve quickly, they are about to get lapped.

The LSAC computerized would make me really antsy, the 2 questions I missed on the GRE were the quantitative section that I made miss calculations because of me a)being nervous and b) sucking at math.

However, the GRE is much more relaxed primarily because you decide the test day for the most part. You can take it 5x in a 12 month span and reup the next 12 months as well, none of this 3 times in 2 years set-up.

(hate to be that guy but don't quote because of me subtlety telling my score. That thread about adcoms has me on edge.)

[jingosaur]

[jingosaur]

I don't know how to react because Harvard doesn't have any Ts in it.

[rpupkin]

I don't know how to react because Harvard doesn't have any Ts in it.

[jingosaur]

I don't know how to react because Harvard doesn't have any Ts in it.

They might as well change the name to "Harvard Extension Law School"

[banjo]

It's the T12 now

[grades??]

It's the T12 now

Confirmed.

[Economyclass]

How would this affect high LSAT low GPA splitters? 3.7 GPA/175+ LSAT

I suppose the median GPA will go up now they have more people with 4.0 GPAs and GRE. This will make it harder for people like me right?

[rav17]

USNWR was really onto something when they bumped down Harvard to #3.

[alpinespring]

I'm genuinely curious -- from an employer's perspective -- doesn't this significantly lower the value of an HLS degree?

How can you be sure this HLS grad (who may have submitted GRE) has similar cognitive horsepower as other HLS grads (who took LSAT)?